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Certifications for the cause

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  • astcell
    replied
    They make everything for PCs. Gotta love SCSI chains.

    Liveable wage? Hmmm,that's debateable, do you know anyone who ever filled out an SF-71 and made a livable wage?

    Leave a comment:


  • Kai
    replied
    hahahaha

    reinforced a$$ mufflers?

    I didn't know they made those for PCs!

    :D

    Kai

    Leave a comment:


  • converge
    replied
    ouch... other than doing something harmful to the user... heheh

    you/your company wouldn't happen to be in need of a tech at the moment would you? I'm starting to scout out job possibilities for a move out of this forsaken state (maine).. will do anything jobwise to get in at a livable wage, the main factor seeking opportunities to move up and into the above-mentioned arena

    Leave a comment:


  • astcell
    replied
    interview acting

    Yea, hype yourself up during the interview, but know your stuff. One question I used to ask was "What one improvement can you make to a desktop PC that will increase its performance for the lowest possible price?"

    Of course the best answer is "double the RAM". Holy cow I swear I'll hire the next guy on the spot who knows that answer, and give him a bonus if he knows what RAM means.

    Answers I've heard: Expand the motherboard, add a zip drive, get a bigger monitor, move it to a cooler spot on the desk, etc....

    Leave a comment:


  • converge
    replied
    Originally posted by Kai
    I'll openly admit I don't know something, but I also know that I have a passion to learn and can do so quickly.
    I hear ya there... I'm starting to wonder if I should just inflate myself at hiring time and adjust accordingly. Even if I land the job, people have such low expectation of me that I can't break the bored barrier into the land of, o shit, I gotta get this working well.

    Leave a comment:


  • Kai
    replied
    <layed off June 2001>
    <still not found a perm position>
    I'm with 'ya there. Laid off in August, been contracting ever since. Found a perm job, but nine days later I was laid off because of "company restructuring". Nice, huh?

    Anyway, I look at the certs as basically being the "ribbon" to wrap around my resume. I'm honest about my abilities, and if anything, too "unsure" of them. I'll openly admit I don't know something, but I also know that I have a passion to learn and can do so quickly.

    I earned my a couple of certs that cost over a grand combined (testing and self study only)on my own dollar, but I'll be the first to admit that my skills don't hold up to my opinion of what those certs once meant. At the moment, I think my eight year old son's skills blow away the average MCSE though!
    ;)

    Kai

    Leave a comment:


  • blackwave
    replied
    Re: certs

    Originally posted by astcell
    It sure beats the guy who asks the same question a thousand times!
    Dude, I am so there... I know one person that fits this to the tee... and damn a few years ago, they were ok, knew a few things.. but then must have hit his head or something because now he doesn't know how to do anything... except brag about his crappy little mcp (yea not msce by a longshot)... but anyone will tell him something, show it to him.. and then like a day later.. it is deja vu... now a few years later I wouldn't piss on a burning building to help him out... I have actually hidden under my desk when i hear his ass coming so I wouldn't have to hear his backwards babble... Also he never has a straight question.. he is the human DDoS...

    /rant is complete. :)

    Leave a comment:


  • astcell
    replied
    certs

    Cisco certification would be nice, but if I had that I would be "overqualified" and no boss would send me to that school. Drat.

    I once felt that a cert was worth about 40% towards the final evaluation of the person. One MCSE did not know that Shift+tab would take you back to the previous box, and another had a heck of a time troubleshooting a Windows error. fter he fought with it for 24 hours I solved the error in 55 seconds. How? I went to the MS Knowledge base and typed in the error message word for word.

    These are some skills that come by doing, not by studying. But one thing I found out. A guy with Certs may ask a thousand questions, but they are all different, and he never asks again. It sure beats the guy who asks the same question a thousand times! (Imagine having an assistant administrator for 6 months who still does not remember the domain name!)

    Leave a comment:


  • TheWatcher
    replied
    I do agree that cert is a piece of paper (crap) but most organization preferred to have it.

    Certification is a good foundation to get a job. Experience with certification is unmatched.

    If you're in the organization, it is recommended to get certified to your field to get good raise. This goes the same for public and private sector.

    In Security Field.
    Management and broad understanding of security, I recommend CISSP certification.

    Specific and deep understanding of tools/knowledge, highly recommended to attend SANS certification such as Firewall training, IDS, Unix, etc.
    Though their website was hacked last year by Fluffy Bunny, I still visit their site for research and documentation.

    Leave a comment:


  • Monshroud
    replied
    You need a combo

    I think what most employers are looking for is the combo of both certs and experience.

    For instance, if you were to work at a company that is a MS Gold Partner. To keep that "Gold" status the company needs a certain amount of MCP's and MCSE's on staff. So if a company had to choose between someone with 10 years exp, or 2 years of exp with a MCSE. Granted the 10+ guy probably knows more, but they have a quota to keep.

    A few years back, all I had was on the job experience. I couldn't find a job because at the time, I had no degree and no certs. I went and got my A+, and my MCSE, etc and all of a sudden finding a job became a whole lot easier.

    The cert doesn't necessarly mean that you know what to do and how to do it, but it does mean that you at least took some inititive to get certified. You paid money for books and classes (or the company thinks that) and you paid money to take these tests. A little investment in yourself says a lot to an employer.

    Of course, I could be wrong.

    Leave a comment:


  • blackwave
    replied
    I will say that I have met several hundred individuals with all varying certificates that they have bought. Though all of them to one degree or another did not understand what they were doing, especially in reference to the cert.

    Certs are pieces of paper that can be taken at the face value. Think of certs as ways to make you look prettier and more attractive to the job market, but nothing more. Most people that know what they are doing do not claim they have certs in whatever. It is the lamers of the world that wear silkscreen prints of their cert collection on their t-shirts thinking they will score chicks, but they can't learn, and will never learn, and will have to rely on people who accept their certs as conventional means to prove any type of brain power.

    As an example I have seen fully certified MSCE's look up at me when they have dropped into a full screen command shell because they have no clue how to use the most basic commands, or how to press alt-enter in a windows environment.

    Certs will never hurt you though, and could open many doors only because of some common belief that certs mean more brainpower... as a hacker, exploit that and get as many certs as you can, especially if you live in the world of money, where more money is better... just don't bring it up that you are cert-master at any conventional social platform. ;)

    Leave a comment:


  • FAWCR
    replied
    Paper is Paper...

    Overall, getting enough paper to fill the "I love me" wall is only good if you can back it up with documentable experience. I have papers (not AKC certified) but without the "paying job" experience in using it, there is no sense in putting it down on the resume. As a friend of sombodies says "OH, so you have never translated that into a commercial application."

    Leave a comment:


  • astcell
    replied
    papers

    Having your papers in order can help the guy who hires you. You see, he has to ask less questions because he knows you know your stuff, and if you fail and have to get fired, then he can say he hired you based on your papers.

    Leave a comment:


  • Apex
    replied
    In my 10 years of experience I have been offered more positions based solely on the fact that I have this cert or that cert, or because of academic degree.

    However I do agree that they are all crap for the most part. Just because I can take a test well, does not mean I can differentiate between my arse and a hole in the ground.

    In the current tech market, the fact that I have one or more of these pieces of paper has been the only thing getting me interviews.


    <layed off June 2001>
    <still not found a perm position>

    Leave a comment:


  • astcell
    replied
    certs..not the candies

    I went to CompUSA for MCSE but never took the tests, but then I started to work the work and do what I was taught. Now I know my stuff and have an MCSE working under me.

    Getting a cert is like reading a book on karate. It's good stuff to know, but it MUST be applied in the real world to really count.

    By the way I had 20 questions at the interview for the MCSE, and when I heard he had certs I knew he could answer the first 6 questions. It was not a slam dunk like the commercials say.

    Bottom line: Get your cert for one reason -- because you WANT to have it for yourself.

    Leave a comment:

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