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  • #16
    Re: Defcon 17 suggestions

    Originally posted by Abby_Normal View Post
    From what I understand, that wasn't the real reason the pool got shut down. I was told that it had more to do with the naked girl in the pool.
    And the fact that the lifeguard was laughed at. His pride was hurt so he lashed at everyone. But he played the "safety" card and had to stick to his guns after that.

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    • #17
      Re: Defcon 17 suggestions

      I noticed more kids this year and would be willing to organize a babysitting exchange or share in the expense of a local bonded sitter. Anyone else interested in something like this?

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      • #18
        Re: Defcon 17 suggestions

        Originally posted by Hurricane View Post
        I noticed more kids this year and would be willing to organize a babysitting exchange or share in the expense of a local bonded sitter. Anyone else interested in something like this?
        This seems like a horrible idea on so many levels to me.
        perl -e 'print pack(c5, (41*2), sqrt(7056), (unpack(c,H)-2), oct(115), 10)'

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        • #19
          Re: Defcon 17 suggestions

          Originally posted by Hurricane View Post
          I noticed more kids this year and would be willing to organize a babysitting exchange or share in the expense of a local bonded sitter. Anyone else interested in something like this?
          Sounds like a great to me. Could potentially draw in some of the more experienced crew who might otherwise forgo the event due to child care issues.

          An exchange is good, just vet the players before the game. Get red cross certs, etc.... Another reason to add a new skill....

          Get a service and vet the service prior to the Con might also be an option. Sharing expenses is always bonus.

          Regardless, kudos for a brilliant idea.
          [/SIZE]
          • 0><'//\/\0r0|\|$

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          • #20
            Re: Defcon 17 suggestions

            Originally posted by SGT_Fury View Post
            Sounds like a great to me. Could potentially draw in some of the more experienced crew who might otherwise forgo the event due to child care issues.

            An exchange is good, just vet the players before the game. Get red cross certs, etc.... Another reason to add a new skill....

            Get a service and vet the service prior to the Con might also be an option. Sharing expenses is always bonus.

            Regardless, kudos for a brilliant idea.
            i'm willing to take a baby sitting shift. i think i still have access to an NES, ect..
            ( hum, gamer tournament ages 5-12?)
            and do age appropriate games , to keep them busy.
            coloring contests , ages 2 to 7
            it's just have to be a safe zone.. no hacking kids displays.
            speed tests for builds. for the older kids . then the one with no interest in any thing tech ....

            ... horsies. and story time ....nerf dogeball?

            or nerf shooting ranges? maybe take the "adult games" and make them into beginner games for the younger group

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            • #21
              Re: Defcon 17 suggestions

              Originally posted by Chris View Post
              This seems like a horrible idea on so many levels to me.
              Agreed. The liability issues alone boggle the mind.

              If there are parents that really want to bring their spawn to DC but can't be bothered to watch them, it would seem that they would be in much better shape if they just outsourced the job to a NV certified/bonded daycare center that has a proper facility.
              Thorn
              "If you can't be a good example, then you'll just have to be a horrible warning." - Catherine Aird

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              • #22
                Re: Defcon 17 suggestions

                The naked female was arguably a plant to get us kicked out, possibly not.. just an already semi naked female really interested in jumping in,.. Out of kindness I saw her swarming the edge of the pool and invited her in, many of us were normally dressed and in the pool. She responded that she could not get her dress wet, then wandered off to dangle her feet in the water. Apparently this became less of a roadblock for her as she removed it prior to getting in, then _immediately_ put it back on once in the water.

                Whatever the case, she was not part of goon swim. Her presence caused the doucheguard to come over, she had already re-dressed upon entering the pool. Flea hurt the doucheguard's manfeelings and a fellow goon with a scratch on his eye became great reason for clearing the entire pool. Interesting that he was less interested in clearing out the rest of the non-defcon poolgoers until he saw we weren't leaving the lawn. At that point it was dependent on maintenance chlorinating and reopening, something they gladly dragged their heels on to make end of day pool close .. I don't believe hotel security was ever a real problem with regard to this, just the doucheguard setting hotel policy into action.

                Kudos on the purchased swimming pool action, iirc strom and someone else pulled this off.

                The best part is that the person with the scratch later ran over to chat up doucheguard. After an exchange and something to the effect of 'dont mess with my authority', person with scratch jumped back into the pool under full 'fuck you' mode with the premise that it was his blood, his risk :p
                if it gets me nowhere, I'll go there proud; and I'm gonna go there free.

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                • #23
                  Re: Defcon 17 suggestions

                  Originally posted by Thorn View Post
                  Agreed. The liability issues alone boggle the mind.

                  If there are parents that really want to bring their spawn to DC but can't be bothered to watch them, it would seem that they would be in much better shape if they just outsourced the job to a NV certified/bonded daycare center that has a proper facility.
                  Adequate planning prevents piss poor performance. The options are myriad. This was the opening of a discussion with no formal solution.

                  Know the attendees, early sign up, vetting, meet and greets.... Certifications.... Buy a service. Too many options to really compare at this point, yet.... There you go. Pissing all over the initial idea.

                  BTW, nobody said anything about bad parents not wanting to be bothered to watch their children. The discussion was to provide adequate care and entertainment for the children while the parents have time to attend various Con events.. As you probably don't know, many families can't stand to be apart for one night, let alone 3 or 4. So bring the kids and have a safe place for them while you attend the briefs, events, contests. Then pick them up for dinner.

                  At least we know there are those who are ready to call CPS on anyone seen bringing children to the Con. Talk about a positive environment to show the kids how great hackers are.
                  [/SIZE]
                  • 0><'//\/\0r0|\|$

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Re: Defcon 17 suggestions

                    Originally posted by SGT_Fury View Post
                    Adequate planning prevents piss poor performance. The options are myriad. This was the opening of a discussion with no formal solution.

                    Know the attendees, early sign up, vetting, meet and greets.... Certifications.... Buy a service. Too many options to really compare at this point, yet.... There you go. Pissing all over the initial idea.

                    BTW, nobody said anything about bad parents not wanting to be bothered to watch their children. The discussion was to provide adequate care and entertainment for the children while the parents have time to attend various Con events.. As you probably don't know, many families can't stand to be apart for one night, let alone 3 or 4. So bring the kids and have a safe place for them while you attend the briefs, events, contests. Then pick them up for dinner.

                    At least we know there are those who are ready to call CPS on anyone seen bringing children to the Con. Talk about a positive environment to show the kids how great hackers are.
                    Nope. Bad idea. I am sure PedoBear would be up for a shift or two.

                    Thorn is right. If you can't stand to be away from your kids for a couple of days then a Nevada Licensed day care center is the way to go. There is no amount of vetting that could ever be done that would get me to leave my kids with a stranger like this.
                    perl -e 'print pack(c5, (41*2), sqrt(7056), (unpack(c,H)-2), oct(115), 10)'

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Re: Defcon 17 suggestions

                      Originally posted by SGT_Fury View Post
                      Adequate planning prevents piss poor performance. The options are myriad. This was the opening of a discussion with no formal solution.

                      Know the attendees, early sign up, vetting, meet and greets.... Certifications.... Buy a service. Too many options to really compare at this point, yet.... There you go. Pissing all over the initial idea.
                      Wow. Apparently a nerve or three was touched here. Yes, I am pissing all over the initial idea, and for good reason. It is a BAD idea.

                      I would agree that adequate planning prevents piss poor performance. No question. So how would that be done? Are you going to run full FBI fingerprint checks against the people who would gladly volunteer for this for the wrong reasons? Who is going to conduct the background investigations required for this type of operation, including civil and criminal checks? Who's going to cover the cost and who's footing the bill for the investigations and insurance? I could go on at length, but I'm sure you get the idea.

                      Originally posted by SGT_Fury View Post
                      BTW, nobody said anything about bad parents not wanting to be bothered to watch their children. The discussion was to provide adequate care and entertainment for the children while the parents have time to attend various Con events.
                      My personal view is that DefCon is the last place to bring a child who is less than 13 or so. Having said that, if you are going to bring them young kids, that's certainly your prerogative; but if you do, then you should either do it right (a NV licensed facility) or watch them yourself.

                      Originally posted by SGT_Fury View Post
                      As you probably don't know, many families can't stand to be apart for one night, let alone 3 or 4. So bring the kids and have a safe place for them while you attend the briefs, events, contests. Then pick them up for dinner..
                      Actually, I do know. I'm a father and a grandfather. But if you can't stand to be away from your family for the length of the con, then either do the child care right, or don't go (which was my choice when my son was young.) This would not be "adequate care" this would be very inadequate. Doing half-assed child care is stupid and potentially dangerous.

                      Originally posted by SGT_Fury View Post
                      At least we know there are those who are ready to call CPS on anyone seen bringing children to the Con. Talk about a positive environment to show the kids how great hackers are.
                      No one said anything about calling CPS, but please explain how leaving your kid with an unlicensed stranger shows them how great hackers are.
                      Thorn
                      "If you can't be a good example, then you'll just have to be a horrible warning." - Catherine Aird

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Re: Defcon 17 suggestions

                        Originally posted by Thorn View Post
                        Agreed. The liability issues alone boggle the mind.

                        If there are parents that really want to bring their spawn to DC but can't be bothered to watch them, it would seem that they would be in much better shape if they just outsourced the job to a NV certified/bonded daycare center that has a proper facility.
                        Defcon is not a kids convention. Hit Circus Circus up and rent the approved BS service.

                        Al
                        "Are my pants...threatening you?"

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                        • #27
                          Re: Defcon 17 suggestions

                          I think the babysitting exchange idea was misunderstood. I'm not suggesting turning DefCon into a family event or BabyCon. I know others bring their children to Vegas with them, but must forgo the parties, etc. I'm simply offering a solution to parents....I watch your little ones one evening while you party and you watch mine the next night so I can go out. It doesn't have to become a liability to the Con or even be associated with the Con.

                          My second suggestion was to hire a local (licensed and bonded) service. Since this service can become costly and most sitters can accommodate 5 or 6 children, I'd like to split the costs. Again, no association to the Con, just posting here where I know other parents will be there for the same reason I am.

                          For those who are not parents, this should not affect you in any way. For those that are, if you are interested, please contact me and we'll discuss over the next year. We can discuss fingerprinting and background checks then.

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                          • #28
                            Re: Defcon 17 suggestions

                            That's not to say that bringing your kids to the con (depending on their age, maturity level, and your own skill in time-management) is a bad thing outright... nor would some sort of "child watching" arrangement be bad... but in my opinion that is a matter that should be handled only among small groups of already-established friends and associates.

                            i'd love to see more groups of people relying on one another for things like that... but as far as planning on a formal arrangement with "professional" people in the mix, folks whom you don't know before seeing them at con, yeah... i'd have to question that.

                            still and all, i could hardly ever imagine bringing kids with me to DEFCON. not at any age that would require thinking about "child care" of any kind. i mean, Bruce & Heidi don't even bring their kids to DEFCON and consider the fact that...
                            1. they (Bruce and Heidi) are wicked smart and capable

                            2. their two boys are among the most mature and level-headed offspring i've ever gotten to meet

                            3. the Potters don't even really party super-hard. i mean, they'll drink but they could actually come back to their room and it wouldn't be bad for the boys. it's not like they'd come back all rolled on X while the kids are asleep.

                            ... in spite of all that, they leave the kids with relatives for BH / DEFCON. to me that just makes more sense. i'm all for being comfortable as opposed to tied down when in America's Playground City.
                            "I'll admit I had an OiNK account and frequented it quite often… What made OiNK a great place was that it was like the world's greatest record store… iTunes kind of feels like Sam Goody to me. I don't feel cool when I go there. I'm tired of seeing John Mayer's face pop up. I feel like I'm being hustled when I visit there, and I don't think their product is that great. DRM, low bit rate, etc... OiNK it existed because it filled a void of what people want."
                            - Trent Reznor

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                            • #29
                              Re: Defcon 17 suggestions

                              Deviant- You think we can get Majorlicks (Matt) a t-shirt that says, "I shot the Fed"?

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                              • #30
                                Re: Defcon 17 suggestions

                                First off another great year for Defcon!

                                I might say this with a bit of caution, but next year I feel releasing more info about how the badge functions might generate more interest in the badge hacking contest. As DT said we've had badge hacking contests for the last 3 years but the participants have only been doubling. There is something to be said though about figuring it out yourself and having a sense of mystery behind it though.

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