Suggesting a new defcon event: Hackers Parliamentary Debate or HPD

[TheCotMan]

Re: Suggesting a new defcon event: Hackers Parliamentary Debate or HPD

So, what am I missing? What's the next step?

Asked and answered:

Just like any other contest or event.

Do you plan on having this happen at Defcon? If you want to have this on the contest floor, then you need to get approval From Russ, and request the resources you might need. Skybox? They might be filled up, or might not. That might require approval from Grifter unless someone else is doing that this year.

If you plan to have the event take place away from Defcon, you will still need approval from DT as either an official or unofficial event.

Once you have approval for space at Defcon, or as an official or unofficial event, then a new forum can be added for the contest/event. Forums are not created unless your contests/event is approved in some way by one of those 3 people mentioned above.

Remember: Just because you get an OK from DT doesn't mean you have space on the contest floor, or a SkyBox! Each domain is controlled by a different person, and they may not have space. It is up to you t follow each thread to completion to get all of the resources you need.

Also, once you have a forum for this contest/event, then you will also need to provide information to Neil (or someone else) if you want your contest/event to be in the program.

If you are following DT's consideration/comments then it might be a candidate for consideration as a "talk" or "presentation" and would then have to contend with all of the other talks as something that people will want to see.

Unless DT say otherwise, then this would suggest that by going this route you would probably go through the same application as the "CFP" (Call for Papers) so you can try to gain approval and access to the resources you need, (like a place to have this happen.) This is a good suggestion to follow while waiting for an official answer from DT himself.

If this were a contest/event on the contest floor, then your direction would be to talk to Russ and get approval from him, Skyboxes through Grifter (assuming he is still the coordinator for them) and of course Neil for main site linkage and probably the DC17 booklet.

Is there enough interest to fill one of the presentation rooms that the talks use? That will probably play a role in whatever decision would be made about approving this as a presentation which will be mutually exclusive to other presentations that would use the same location at the same time.

Good luck.

[gadi]

Re: Suggesting a new defcon event: Hackers Parliamentary Debate or HPD

So, what am I missing? What's the next step?

[LosT]

Re: Suggesting a new defcon event: Hackers Parliamentary Debate or HPD

Depending on the topic I would be interested in this.

Depending.

[gadi]

Re: Suggesting a new defcon event: Hackers Parliamentary Debate or HPD

DT:
Thanks for your message.

The event can be constructed around any resources you give us.

We believe that for a first event, we should probably limit the tournament to 8 teams.

10? 20? experienced debaters?

We don't believe "experienced debaters" are required. While previous experience certainly is nice, anyone can debate and Steve Llano will create quick-and-dirty training material for hackers toward the event.

- Space for how many hours?

We could do a one hour event, but that is far from optimal.
What we'd like to do, is have 4 hours total distributed throughout defcon (in one day, two, or all three).

- How much space to host it? Two tables, a podium, and chars for XXX audience members?

1. Table for 4 people on either side of a podium (total 8). A podium.
2. One Microphone on podium and one for judges who can sit at another table.
3. If we indeed take it that way, some beer.

Could it be done as a special presentation, or does it have to run all day?

Running the sessions like a defcon lecture is probably the best idea.

Thanks
Gadi.

[gadi]

Re: Suggesting a new defcon event: Hackers Parliamentary Debate or HPD

noid, reading the thread again I do see interest, right along-side the usual mockery from our crowd, some skepticism and one troll.

Question is, is this going to be given a chance? Mockery aside, it will be a success for the following reasons:

1. It's an interactive session, discussing the very religious and very fun matters which our community loves to fight about.

2. We are building it for audience participation as an alcohol game (think TCP/IP game).

3. While a "mature" activity, it is a very adversarial contest. People love fighting (think Hacker Jeopardy).

4. Much like any other event, it is new and therefore interesting.

5. Both Dan Kaminsky and myself, good speakers with a following of people who come to our lectures at defcon, are working on this.
While it seems snobish and unrelated to content, it's only practical--it means that crowds who always come to see either of us "perform" will show up here as well, and the room will be crowded.

6. Even if we do somehow fail, it will indeed be a very fun experience for everyone involved to watch us do so.

We believe in it to try it out, and that it's worth our time to organize. We are willing to commit--that alone shows how serious we are as you guys understand what it is to be busy (except for the troll).

I won't lie to you, there is a possibility this won't work out much like anything else, but give it a chance, if you will. Aren't hackers about not being set in our ways and trying out new things?

How do we move forward in the decision process? Do we just contact one of the people mentioned, or is there something else we should do?

[YenTheFirst]

Re: Suggesting a new defcon event: Hackers Parliamentary Debate or HPD

This could be fun, I think.

[Dark Tangent]

Re: Suggesting a new defcon event: Hackers Parliamentary Debate or HPD

Well to be honest the people mocking it are the people least likely to participate. From what I have read it is muy popular at anime cons.. don't ask me why, anime never seemed like the most logical medium to learn debate through.. but in order to work you would need:

- 10? 20? experienced debaters?
- Space for how many hours?
- How much space to host it? Two tables, a podium, and chars for XXX audience members?

Could it be done as a special presentation, or does it have to run all day?

[noid]

Re: Suggesting a new defcon event: Hackers Parliamentary Debate or HPD

Thanks everyone for your replies, and interest.

A debate is not just a long boring diatribe, but a contest, an engagement between teams. Each speaker only has a short time to make his or her case before the other side attacks it.

It's interesting, and I believe that with alcohol and fun, it will fit right in with the defcon crowd--especially as the crowd will be the debaters.

As an unexpected consequence, perhaps some of our people won't just have fun but also learn a bit about how to build arguments and make sense with people, rather than just compilers.

I believe it's worth a shot, and will be fun.

So, how do we proceed with the process?

Thanks,

Gadi.

Heh. Outside of 'Jolly' I didnt see any interest here. Just a lot of mockery. Maybe you could put together an event that lets event organizers work on their perception.

[TheCotMan]

Re: Suggesting a new defcon event: Hackers Parliamentary Debate or HPD

So, how do we proceed with the process?

Just like any other contest or event.

Do you plan on having this happen at Defcon? If you want to have this on the contest floor, then you need to get approval From Russ, and request the resources you might need. Skybox? They might be filled up, or might not. That might require approval from Grifter unless someone else is doing that this year.

If you plan to have the event take place away from Defcon, you will still need approval from DT as either an official or unofficial event.

Once you have approval for space at Defcon, or as an official or unofficial event, then a new forum can be added for the contest/event. Forums are not created unless your contests/event is approved in some way by one of those 3 people mentioned above.

Remember: Just because you get an OK from DT doesn't mean you have space on the contest floor, or a SkyBox! Each domain is controlled by a different person, and they may not have space. It is up to you t follow each thread to completion to get all of the resources you need.

Also, once you have a forum for this contest/event, then you will also need to provide information to Neil (or someone else) if you want your contest/event to be in the program.

[gadi]

Re: Suggesting a new defcon event: Hackers Parliamentary Debate or HPD

Thanks everyone for your replies, and interest.

A debate is not just a long boring diatribe, but a contest, an engagement between teams. Each speaker only has a short time to make his or her case before the other side attacks it.

It's interesting, and I believe that with alcohol and fun, it will fit right in with the defcon crowd--especially as the crowd will be the debaters.

As an unexpected consequence, perhaps some of our people won't just have fun but also learn a bit about how to build arguments and make sense with people, rather than just compilers.

I believe it's worth a shot, and will be fun.

So, how do we proceed with the process?

Thanks,

Gadi.

[Dallas]

Re: Suggesting a new defcon event: Hackers Parliamentary Debate or HPD

Are guns allowed? Might be a good way to win the debate, actually can we just step 20 paces and shoot?

Don't we already have this? I thought that's what Hacker Jeopardy was for?

(invisible smiley for the humor impaired)

[shrdlu]

Re: Suggesting a new defcon event: Hackers Parliamentary Debate or HPD

My guess..about 3 minutes..

I bet this sounded like a great idea when they came up with it at the bar..

Don't we already have this? I thought that's what Hacker Jeopardy was for?

(invisible smiley for the humor impaired)

[Jolly]

Re: Suggesting a new defcon event: Hackers Parliamentary Debate or HPD

If you have good speakers, then parli can be very entertaining - but the caveat is, you need good speakers.

[noid]

Re: Suggesting a new defcon event: Hackers Parliamentary Debate or HPD

It would be entertaining to watch for sure. Not sure how long it will hold peoples attention?

My guess..about 3 minutes..

I bet this sounded like a great idea when they came up with it at the bar..

[Jolly]

Re: Suggesting a new defcon event: Hackers Parliamentary Debate or HPD

Best idea ever! Count me in.