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  • noid
    replied
    Re: We have our new location (was: Ugh... So, we're gonna need a new location YET AGA

    nearest Avis drop off point is the Venetian

    Leave a comment:


  • Deviant Ollam
    replied
    Re: We have our new location (was: Ugh... So, we're gonna need a new location YET AGA

    Originally posted by xor View Post
    Ps If you rent from Hertz, you can leave the rental right at the Hertz office at the Riv. This way no special trip to the airport and back mid-con is required in order to save money.
    that is really really good information. do you know if any other rental providers offer this same feature at the Riv? or is it just Hertz?

    Leave a comment:


  • Merlin
    replied
    Re: We have our new location (was: Ugh... So, we're gonna need a new location YET AGA

    Originally posted by xor View Post
    So I guess the question is, is this where the Shoot will take place? Perhaps I should upgrade my rental car to something beefier if that is the case.

    Merlin, were you like ghost riding while taking that video?

    xor

    Ps If you rent from Hertz, you can leave the rental right at the Hertz office at the Riv. This way no special trip to the airport and back mid-con is required in order to save money.
    Any car will be just fine. It is actually decent road all the way to the site.

    And no, just sticking the camera out of the sunroof.

    Leave a comment:


  • xor
    replied
    Re: We have our new location (was: Ugh... So, we're gonna need a new location YET AGA

    So I guess the question is, is this where the Shoot will take place? Perhaps I should upgrade my rental car to something beefier if that is the case.

    Merlin, were you like ghost riding while taking that video?

    xor

    Ps If you rent from Hertz, you can leave the rental right at the Hertz office at the Riv. This way no special trip to the airport and back mid-con is required in order to save money.

    Leave a comment:


  • Merlin
    replied
    Re: We have our new location (was: Ugh... So, we're gonna need a new location YET AGA

    thank you so much for doing this recon, man! may i ask... about 26 seconds into the video you pass what looks like a turning road on the left. is that the trail entrance that shows up on the composite sat map i posted about halfway down and all the way to the right side of the image?
    Yeah, it's a trail, but not usable for vehicles. Looks like mainly an ATV entrance to the campsite.

    i like the solar aspect of that plan... my only concern is one of distance.

    perhaps you can grab the virgin copy of that image from me and sketch on it somehow indicating how and where we can get 100 yards, because i'm having trouble visualizing it. that likely has to do with the way Google shows the terrain, which may not reflect reality at this time.
    I will have a look at it next week. The weekend family thing started about 6 hours ago.


    again... sketch on the image if you can so we can see where the backstop fully extends. (is that the mountainside, you mean? or one of the manmande backstops i've seen in that video?)
    The side of the mountain is the ultimate backstop. THere are some berms leading up to it. I have some still photos as well that I need to get off of my phone and send to you. I used my kids in the photos as a point of reference.

    holy shit... you are fucking awesome. i think you should get half your shirts for free for doing this.
    I like free shirts. And donuts. And chicks in knee-high leather boots. Better stop there..



    sometimes when i've arranged shoots out in a field or something we use two stakes in the ground with a rope strung between them about a foot or two off the dirt. many small
    Can do. I usually keep various strings and ropes in my truck. Right now, I probably have 500ft of 550 cord. (I love cheaper-than-dirt)


    if we have more than one RSO, having small radios could help, depending on distances.
    GOt a couple of Motorola FRS in my truck. Of course, I am sure this crowd has no shortage of radio gear.. I keep meaning to get into HAM, gotta find the time.

    i think that's the least you deserve for helping out with all of this the way that you are. hell, if i didn't want to be at the Riv the morning of the shoot to help coordinate people for the carpool, etc. i'd ask if i could camp out there with you the night before.
    Too bad, that would be cool. Speaking of which, if anyone DOES want to come out the night before, I have 5 queen beds to spare. Plenty of camp chairs, camp fire, smores, etc.
    I figure the easiest way to be up on time is to start the day there.

    one other question... any chance of cel service out there? what sort of signal, if any, do you see from what carrier(s)?
    Acutally yes, I forgot to mention that. I specifically tested AT&T and Sprint, so both technologies are covered. I am not sure if Verizon folks can roam on the Sprint tower, or T-Mobile on the AT&T, but there is coverage. Bear in mind it is like 1 bar, but better than nothing.

    Leave a comment:


  • Deviant Ollam
    replied
    Re: We have our new location (was: Ugh... So, we're gonna need a new location YET AGA

    Originally posted by Merlin View Post
    thank you so much for doing this recon, man! may i ask... about 26 seconds into the video you pass what looks like a turning road on the left. is that the trail entrance that shows up on the composite sat map i posted about halfway down and all the way to the right side of the image?

    Originally posted by Merlin View Post
    The firing line will be facing west ... sun behind us in the morning.
    i like the solar aspect of that plan... my only concern is one of distance.

    Originally posted by Merlin View Post
    probably get close to 100 yards out of the main area
    perhaps you can grab the virgin copy of that image from me and sketch on it somehow indicating how and where we can get 100 yards, because i'm having trouble visualizing it. that likely has to do with the way Google shows the terrain, which may not reflect reality at this time.

    Originally posted by Merlin View Post
    possible that we will see temps in the 90's ...Boulder City is typically 5 degress hotter than LV.
    nod. i want as cool as possible. and this area seems to have the "cool" thing covered, in terms of temp and style.

    Originally posted by Merlin View Post
    possible that we could angle another line aiming to the southwest, but we would have to be careful about ensuring that we are still well covered by the backstop.
    again... sketch on the image if you can so we can see where the backstop fully extends. (is that the mountainside, you mean? or one of the manmande backstops i've seen in that video?)

    Originally posted by Merlin View Post
    RV ... EZ-UP ... water cooler ... couple of tables ... a few camp chairs
    holy shit... you are fucking awesome. i think you should get half your shirts for free for doing this.

    Originally posted by Merlin View Post
    target stands ... if I can wrangle one of my buddies to go up there with me the night before
    you are nine kinds of awesome if that happens.

    Originally posted by Merlin View Post
    mark the firing line
    sometimes when i've arranged shoots out in a field or something we use two stakes in the ground with a rope strung between them about a foot or two off the dirt. many small orange ribbons tied to the rope. when the range is hot, the rope is up... tightly tied off between the stakes. no one can walk out there without clearly getting tripped up on the rope. when the range goes cold, after RSOs observe all firearms down and safe and people away from them, the rope is dropped to the ground.

    Originally posted by Merlin View Post
    air horn / bullhorn
    just don't get a super cheap airhorn. i had one of those little "can" models at last year's shoot and the top broke off the first time i tried to call a cease-fire. total piece of shit. bullhorn is a nice idea, but between my loud voice and our group's relatively small size i think we'll be alright. if we have more than one RSO, having small radios could help, depending on distances.

    Originally posted by Merlin View Post
    Any other ideas for a shopping list? Maybe we should get a new thread going for that.
    not a bad idea.

    Originally posted by Merlin View Post
    leftover ammo... I'm yer guy
    i think that's the least you deserve for helping out with all of this the way that you are. hell, if i didn't want to be at the Riv the morning of the shoot to help coordinate people for the carpool, etc. i'd ask if i could camp out there with you the night before.

    one other question... any chance of cel service out there? what sort of signal, if any, do you see from what carrier(s)?

    Leave a comment:


  • Merlin
    replied
    Re: We have our new location (was: Ugh... So, we're gonna need a new location YET AGA

    Youtube Video of the location

    Best I could do with a phone-cam and lots of lens-flare.

    Observations:

    1) The firing line will be facing west, which means we will have the sun behind us in the morning.

    2) I was there ~18:00, and the temp was 83f, while the valley below was ~103f (@ ~19:00). This difference should be even more substantial in the AM, as there is a mountain to the east as well, so the sunrise at this location is a touch later than the valley, and it will have cooled significantly overnight. It is still possible that we will see temps in the 90's, but there is nowhere else in the county that will be any better. Also, FYI, Boulder City is typically 5 degress hotter than LV.

    3) I would say we can probably get close to 100 yards out of the main area I have identified as a firing line. It is possible that we could angle another line aiming to the southwest, but we would have to be careful about ensuring that we are still well covered by the backstop.

    4) I will park my RV with the doorside facing east, towards the firing line, and will have my shade awning out, as well as a 10x10 EZ-UP. I am planning to bring a 5g water cooler as well, but y'all are on your own for a water bottle. Bring one, and you can fill off my big orange teet.

    5) I will try to have a couple of tables out, and a few camp chairs for chillin in the shade, should you so desire.

    6) A few years ago, I had built some target stands out of sawhorse brackets and 2x4's. I am thinking I may do this again if I can wrangle one of my buddies to go up there with me the night before to help set it up. I'll post more as the date gets closer. The good news is there are some small (2 feet) hills just before the actual backstop, so those will probably serve as decent fruit stands. Someone could also "acquire" some wooden pallets on the way up to the site to use as target stands.

    7) I have some of that construction marking tape that we can probably use to mark the firing line, that sort of thing.

    8) We should probably have an air horn for attention getting. Just one of those canned things. If anyone has a bullhorn for the RSO to use, that would probably be a good thing too. Any other ideas for a shopping list? Maybe we should get a new thread going for that.

    9) Lastly, if anyone has any leftover ammo that they don't want to lug home, I'm yer guy. I still have some from like 10 years ago. I guess by now, you'd think I woulda bought a gun to match the ammo...

    Leave a comment:


  • Deviant Ollam
    replied
    Re: We have our new location (was: Ugh... So, we're gonna need a new location YET AGA

    Originally posted by Merlin View Post
    Ok, so I went out and checked the site, and yes, I think it will work handily. I did take video, and Youtube is comtemplating my request right now. I will update here as soon as it is complete.
    great, man! how accurate were my assumptions as shown on the map?

    i assume much of that will become clear when we see the video. thanks again so much for scouting out this territory! (and suggesting it in the first place!)

    Leave a comment:


  • Merlin
    replied
    Re: We have our new location (was: Ugh... So, we're gonna need a new location YET AGA

    Ok, so I went out and checked the site, and yes, I think it will work handily. I did take video, and Youtube is comtemplating my request right now. I will update here as soon as it is complete.

    Leave a comment:


  • TheCotMan
    replied
    Originally posted by Merlin View Post
    As a side note, there has been discussion recently opencarry.org about getting an Open Carry protest walk going on the strip soon. In the past, individuals have done it, and been harassed by police, even though NV is in fact Open Carry (ok, "Free Carry"). We were thinking that getting a bunch of guys with bright orange T-Shirts that say "2nd/4th/5th/6th ammendment activist" would alleviate the police problems, as word would get out quickly to just leave us alone (one of the board posters already has a civil rights abuse case in the works against metro). There was also talk about printing up little brochures about the Open Carry movement to inform the inquiring tourists. In case anyone is interested...
    Please, no political activism on the forums, as activism is too political.

    Somewhere around here, I have a post that describes what is too political, and provide examples.

    I'll see if I can find it.

    Here it is:

    Originally posted by samples
    Things to avoid: (Samples that contribute to subjective judgements of "too political")
    Activism: too political (should/shouldn't)
    Value Judgements: Targetting laws, leaders. parties, or governments with value judgements.
    Solicitation: Support building with respect to laws, leaders, parties
    Calls to arms: like solicitation, but combined with activism makes this worse

    RedFlag KeyWords that demand closer inspection of content:
    right, wrong, should, shouldn't, political parties, names of specific leaders, government (the word or specific proper names) , references to specific leaders by title, requests for [votes|help|support|action], increase to fallacy count, replay of politically charged phrases ["Remember 9/11" | "Remember the Alamo" | "Never again" | "Weapons of Mass Destruction." | "War on [Drugs|Terror|Poverty|Illiteracy]"] , incitful labels ["war monger", "tree hugger" , "baby killer" , "bleeding heart"
    Trying to organize people to strike, picket, or meet to announce their unhappiness with laws are "calls to arms" and requests for action, meeting the description for political activism.

    Leave a comment:


  • Merlin
    replied
    Re: Lovell Canyon location

    Ok, Ok, I will do my damnedest to get up there tonight and take pics/video. I can see that is all that is left to help us settle on a place.

    Like I said, I haven't been there personally, so I can't speak to size or layout. I just know that it is popular, and I am comfortable with the legality.


    As a side note, there has been discussion recently opencarry.org about getting an Open Carry protest walk going on the strip soon. In the past, individuals have done it, and been harassed by police, even though NV is in fact Open Carry (ok, "Free Carry"). We were thinking that getting a bunch of guys with bright orange T-Shirts that say "2nd/4th/5th/6th ammendment activist" would alleviate the police problems, as word would get out quickly to just leave us alone (one of the board posters already has a civil rights abuse case in the works against metro). There was also talk about printing up little brochures about the Open Carry movement to inform the inquiring tourists. In case anyone is interested...

    Leave a comment:


  • Deviant Ollam
    replied
    Lovell Canyon location

    Merlin,

    Care to comment on some map markup that i have done here? I'm just working from what i can assume based on Google Maps sat view, but is the large area i've shown in blue the canyon / river wash zone? what looked like a white blob may have been a truck, so i'm assuming that it (plus the distance scale offered by Google) gives me a rough idea of sorts.

    what do you (or anyone else) think of the following...


    ... is this feasible at all? is it possible to have two firing lines for pistol vs. rifle and do them safely? (safely with independent hot/cold status, i mean)

    not seeing the lay of the land, i can't assume anything. for simplicity's sake, it may be best to just have one single range and keep the hot/cold designations universal across all shooters simultaneously. let me know what you think.

    here is an unmarked copy of the map image used above, if you want to show your own annotated suggestion layout.

    Leave a comment:


  • Deviant Ollam
    replied
    Re: We have our new location (was: Ugh... So, we're gonna need a new location YET AGA

    currently, my favorite-sounding site is the Lovell Group Campsite. i like it for the following reasons...
    1. cool climate - being up in the mountains it's likely to be a lot better than dripping buckets of sweat out in the desert like we were last year, or like we would be at the Boulder City facility.

    2. cool regulations - i'm not saying we can have a free-for-all, but the fact that there are no admission fees or staff costs surely helps to keep the dollar concern down for all parties. that's of prominent interest this year in this economy, where our wallets can be dedicated strictly to ammo, gas, and targets.

    3. cool atmosphere - seriously, i can't get over how much the sound of this reminds me of Fear and Loathing...
    ... but of course we won't be shooting in all directions.

    4. ability to lock-in our presence - the Boulder City range stated we would likely be guaranteed space, but that it's still first come, first serve whenever people arrive at 08:00. if Merlin is indeed considering camping out there the night before, we'd have a real guarantee of our own space, i'd think.

    what do others think? even if we haven't hammered out all details to our liking, i'd like to lock this in one way or another by the end of the week. it's only fair to give attendees plenty of lead time so they know what's happening and also if we're canceling on Boulder City i want to do it well in advance of DEFCON, so they don't suddenly have a large group not show (if they were asking RSOs or other staff to re-arrange their personal and work schedules, let's say)

    Merlin, you're the man with the ball in his court now... let's get some real solid intel (either from direct views or just by continuing to fill us in on the whole description of the grounds) this week.
    Last edited by Deviant Ollam; July 1, 2009, 10:51.

    Leave a comment:


  • Merlin
    replied
    Re: We have our new location (was: Ugh... So, we're gonna need a new location YET AGA

    The Forest Service allows shooting on the 316,000 acres it controls in the Spring Mountains National Recreation Area, provided gunslingers abide by local and state laws. (A favorite spot is near the Lovell Group Campsite on Lovell Canyon Road, off State Route 160, officials said.)
    Oh, and in case you didn't pick it up, this is the place I was referring to.

    Leave a comment:


  • Merlin
    replied
    Re: We have our new location (was: Ugh... So, we're gonna need a new location YET AGA

    Originally posted by Deviant Ollam View Post
    really? is it a known shooting spot? or is it legal to just setup targets and shoot in unincorporated parts of the desert?
    I was gonna post the article from the Sun, but someone beat me to it. It pretty much says it all.

    Originally posted by Deviant Ollam View Post
    that would be amazing of you, man... thanks!
    Ok, I'll get up there asap.

    Originally posted by Deviant Ollam View Post
    does that mean that shooters will be separated from each other when shooting?
    I'll know more once I go up there. I haven't personally used this spot, I just know of it because several gun clubs regularly use it as their summer spot. I haven't managed to go with them any of these times due to schedule conflicts, etc.

    Once I check it out, I will get some approx measurements of distance and such, how wide the line will be, that sort of thing.


    Originally posted by Deviant Ollam View Post
    on this same topic... does the "spot outside of town" discussed above allow us to shoot whatever we want? can class-III and NFA firearms be fired outdoors in unregulated space like that? (or am i misunderstanding... what is the exact legal status of the ground being discussed above, which i like the sound of a lot)
    I don't see any reason any of those things wouldn't be OK. The article from the Sun corroborates that. (did someone here actually write the Sun, or is it just incredible convenient coincidence?)

    Leave a comment:

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