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Who is organizing DefconKids?

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  • #16
    Re: Who is organizing DefconKids?

    Originally posted by StealHead View Post
    The goons that are working the door's are already set, they are goons that helped organize the event and will be vigilant in making sure that no parent or child leaves independently of each other.
    Then they aren't security goons it sounds like. Looks like you'll just be using speaker goons.

    I posted this in the other thread, but I guess this one is more active so I'll repost:

    Nothing in the past has ever prevented anyone, goon or human, from bringing their children to defcon and allowing them to participate in anything and everything defcon-related up to maybe the age-restricted parties. We've never asked for so much as a name, let alone ID and signing of lawerly forms, so why are we doing this for two little rooms during the con?

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    • #17
      Re: Who is organizing DefconKids?

      Originally posted by chs View Post
      Nothing in the past has ever prevented anyone, goon or human, from bringing their children to defcon and allowing them to participate in anything and everything defcon-related up to maybe the age-restricted parties. We've never asked for so much as a name, let alone ID and signing of lawerly forms, so why are we doing this for two little rooms during the con?

      I could be incorrect, but I believe the purpose of this is to have activities geared specifically towards children.
      And I heard a voice in the midst of the four beasts, And I looked and behold: a pale horse. And his name, that sat on him, was Death. And Hell followed with him.

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      • #18
        Re: Who is organizing DefconKids?

        They sign the waiver for liability reasons predominantly see DTs post on the subject https://forum.defcon.org/showpost.ph...4&postcount=32

        There will also be a guideline section about how we can kick you and your kid out at any point and what is expected out of the parents and kids attending.

        If you don't want to sign it then don't attend DefCon Kids.
        Last edited by StealHead; June 30, 2011, 18:38.

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        • #19
          Re: Who is organizing DefconKids?

          Originally posted by StealHead View Post
          They sign the waiver for liability reasons predominantly see DTs post on the subject https://forum.defcon.org/showpost.ph...4&postcount=32

          There will also be a guideline section about how we can kick you and your kid out at any point and what is expected out of the parents and kids attending.

          If you don't want to sign it then don't attend DefCon Kids.
          Uhhh, I think you might have replied to the wrong post.
          And I heard a voice in the midst of the four beasts, And I looked and behold: a pale horse. And his name, that sat on him, was Death. And Hell followed with him.

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          • #20
            Re: Who is organizing DefconKids?

            Originally posted by HighWiz View Post
            Uhhh, I think you might have replied to the wrong post.
            Sorry about that let me go edit.

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            • #21
              Re: Who is organizing DefconKids?

              Originally posted by chs View Post
              Then they aren't security goons it sounds like. Looks like you'll just be using speaker goons.

              I posted this in the other thread, but I guess this one is more active so I'll repost:
              I just confirmed that no security goons will be working the DefCon kids rooms, unless of course the kids get totally out of control and try to take over ;)

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              • #22
                Re: Who is organizing DefconKids?

                Most of the news articles are just sensationalism (surprised?). I'm kinda surprised that once StealHead, did the FAQ and explained what was going on with it all, that people still have such an issue with it. From the sound of things, it looks like it will be well organized and turn out to be a good event.
                Last edited by HighWiz; June 30, 2011, 18:50. Reason: added link
                And I heard a voice in the midst of the four beasts, And I looked and behold: a pale horse. And his name, that sat on him, was Death. And Hell followed with him.

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                • #23
                  Re: Who is organizing DefconKids?

                  Originally posted by HighWiz View Post
                  Most of the news articles are just sensationalism (surprised?). I'm kinda surprised that once StealHead, did the FAQ and explained what was going on with it all, that people still have such an issue with it. From the sound of things, it looks like it will be well organized and turn out to be a good event.
                  Thanks HighWiz.

                  I think this is going to be a great event and I know that we are going to learn a hell of a lot from it, both the positive and negative.

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                  • #24
                    Re: Who is organizing DefconKids?

                    Originally posted by StealHead View Post
                    They sign the waiver for liability reasons predominantly see DTs post on the subject https://forum.defcon.org/showpost.ph...4&postcount=32

                    If you don't want to sign it then don't attend DefCon Kids.
                    Ok, but then they can still attend the entire REST OF DEFCON. Without any kind of liability waiver.

                    So again, how does the liability waiver protect anyone, especially if a parent decides not to attend Kidcon and is therefore exempt from the waiver requirements?

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                    • #25
                      Re: Who is organizing DefconKids?

                      Originally posted by chs View Post
                      Ok, but then they can still attend the entire REST OF DEFCON. Without any kind of liability waiver.

                      So again, how does the liability waiver protect anyone, especially if a parent decides not to attend Kidcon and is therefore exempt from the waiver requirements?
                      chs I'm not sure I'm following you. Anyone can attend DEFCON with or without a child.
                      from the DEFCON FAQ:

                      What are the rules of DEF CON?

                      Physical violence is prohibited. We don't support illegal drug use. Minors should be accompanied by their parent(s) or guardian(s). Please refrain from doing anything that might jeopardize the conference or attendees such as lighting your hair on fire or throwing lit road flares in elevators. DEF CON Goons are there to answer your questions and keep everything moving. Hotel security is there to watch over their property. Each has a different mission, and it is wise to not anger the hotel people. Please be aware that if you engage in illegal activities there is a large contingency of feds that attend DEF CON. Talking about how you are going to bomb the RNC convention in front of an FBI agent is a Career Limiting Move!

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                      • #26
                        Re: Who is organizing DefconKids?

                        Originally posted by StealHead View Post
                        chs I'm not sure I'm following you. Anyone can attend DEFCON with or without a child.
                        from the DEFCON FAQ:

                        What are the rules of DEF CON?

                        Physical violence is prohibited. We don't support illegal drug use. Minors should be accompanied by their parent(s) or guardian(s). Please refrain from doing anything that might jeopardize the conference or attendees such as lighting your hair on fire or throwing lit road flares in elevators. DEF CON Goons are there to answer your questions and keep everything moving. Hotel security is there to watch over their property. Each has a different mission, and it is wise to not anger the hotel people. Please be aware that if you engage in illegal activities there is a large contingency of feds that attend DEF CON. Talking about how you are going to bomb the RNC convention in front of an FBI agent is a Career Limiting Move!
                        Clearly you don't get it.

                        What's the point of the liability waiver if it only covers 1%, if even that, of Defcon?

                        And again, what's the point of such enhanced security if it covers 1%, if even that, of Defcon?

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                        • #27
                          Re: Who is organizing DefconKids?

                          Originally posted by StealHead View Post
                          chs I'm not sure I'm following you. Anyone can attend DEFCON with or without a child.
                          Why waiver for parents+kids at KidCon, since no waiver for parents+kids is needed to attended DefCon?
                          “If someone has a gun and is trying to kill you, it would be reasonable to shoot back with your own gun.” - Dalai Lama (Seattle Times, 05-15-2001).

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                          • #28
                            Re: Who is organizing DefconKids?

                            Originally posted by chs View Post
                            Clearly you don't get it.

                            What's the point of the liability waiver if it only covers 1%, if even that, of Defcon?

                            And again, what's the point of such enhanced security if it covers 1%, if even that, of Defcon?
                            DefCon Kids is for children 8-16 (minors) accompanied by their parent. They will be soldering stuff, etc, a liability waiver is a must.

                            Check out the schedule and tell me you wouldn't want to go to this event...http://www.defconkids.org/?page_id=10 or the workstation room http://www.defconkids.org/?page_id=12

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                            • #29
                              Re: Who is organizing DefconKids?

                              Originally posted by StealHead View Post
                              They will be soldering stuff, etc, a liability waiver is a must.
                              well, we have had the Hardware Hacking Village for years now, no waivers required. also the Maker Faire events feature many such activities... no waivers there, either (they do have waivers, but mostly for rides and things)

                              i'm not saying i don't see where you're coming from... but i also most certainly see where the whole community is coming from regarding the fact that this is a great deal of "over-arching caution" that is typically incongruous with the whole DEFCON vibe.
                              "I'll admit I had an OiNK account and frequented it quite often… What made OiNK a great place was that it was like the world's greatest record store… iTunes kind of feels like Sam Goody to me. I don't feel cool when I go there. I'm tired of seeing John Mayer's face pop up. I feel like I'm being hustled when I visit there, and I don't think their product is that great. DRM, low bit rate, etc... OiNK it existed because it filled a void of what people want."
                              - Trent Reznor

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                              • #30
                                Re: Who is organizing DefconKids?

                                Originally posted by Deviant Ollam View Post
                                i'm not saying i don't see where you're coming from... but i also most certainly see where the whole community is coming from regarding the fact that this is a great deal of "over-arching caution" that is typically incongruous with the whole DEFCON vibe.
                                Not to throw DT under the bus, but it seems like he is the one who is very big on the liability waivers [which makes sense, since ultimately (legally/reputation) it's his ass on the line].
                                And I heard a voice in the midst of the four beasts, And I looked and behold: a pale horse. And his name, that sat on him, was Death. And Hell followed with him.

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