Competition Shoot for DefCon21 Shoot Event

[TheSiscoCoon]

Re: Competition Shoot for DefCon21 Shoot Event

Thanks for the support everyone. Sorry it took me so long to get back with everyone, been getting back into the real world again.

No one owes me money from DC21, some other people gave me more so it all worked out in the end. Whats important is everyone had fun. I decided to rebuild the Sig and buy another Mag for it is because a number of people didn't have a gun to use, either because they didn't own one or couldn't bring one with them. The poll for the money thing....well I guess I jumped on that one too fast. I'll wait until they open up the forum for DC22 and I'll open up a poll for that there.

Truth is I'm not too sure exactly how I'm going to do things next year. And depending on if pyro makes my event official or unofficial I may have access to some goodies to give away. I was also thinking I may do kind of a lottery event for someone to win Free entry to Defcon. Or I may award 1 person from each class (Hand Gun & Rifle) free entry to Defcon. Not sure exactly what I'm going to do yet, but I'm trying to think of different ways I can give you guys something worth something in hopes that more people will want to do the event.

I'm not sure when they will lock this forum, but until then I think it is okay to keep posting your ideas on here for DC22. When the forum opens up for DC22 I'll post things up there. I'm not sure (highly doubt it) if I'll have my own section on the forum for my even, but I'll try to let everyone know about it.

Thanks again and please keep the ideas coming, even if I don't reply I do read them all.

[Rewt Daemon]

Re: Competition Shoot for DefCon21 Shoot Event

I would like to make kind of a poll right now if people don't mind. It was suggested to me to charge a small amount of money like $5.00 to run my course for next year since I spent so much of my own money to do it this year. Honestly I don't mind the money too much, but IF I DID charge, the money would go to the cost in materials to create more targets and the consumables required (paints paper and maybe even targets and such as in cardboard). If I collected more money than was used for the years event I would donate the rest to what Charity the masses decided on (EFF,etc). What does everyone think about that?

Would you guys pay like $5.00 to run my competition, that of course would count for shooting my ammo on the sniper shot. Even thought my rifle will shoot any ammo everyone really would want to use the same brand and type to make things fare. And those that are out of country and couldn't bring there own firearm or can't own a firearm, it would include the renting of my Sig (it WILL be rebuilt from factory Sig so you shouldn't have any problems this time and I'll spend the money and buy another Mag for $65.00 and try to get a left hand and right hand holster for it).

Sorry for the long post, but please people read it and think about it and let me know. It all depends on YOU how things will go and EVEN IF I'LL do it again next year.

TheSiscoCoon I am definitely game for spending $5 on the competition. I actually owe you $5 already so add it to my tab and be sure to collect! I am keen to do it again next year and will start the process of getting permits to export and import some of my firearms for the event next month - hopefully with plenty of time to do so.

I am also very glad to hear you are going to have the Sig rebuilt, it is a beautiful little pistol and when you said you had considered dumping it my heart was nearly broken: if I could have arranged to get it back into the country here I would have offered you cash on the spot!

-- rewtd

[Caspian]

Re: Competition Shoot for DefCon21 Shoot Event

I would like to make kind of a poll right now if people don't mind. It was suggested to me to charge a small amount of money like $5.00 to run my course for next year since I spent so much of my own money to do it this year. Honestly I don't mind the money too much, but IF I DID charge, the money would go to the cost in materials to create more targets and the consumables required (paints paper and maybe even targets and such as in cardboard). If I collected more money than was used for the years event I would donate the rest to what Charity the masses decided on (EFF,etc). What does everyone think about that?

Would you guys pay like $5.00 to run my competition, that of course would count for shooting my ammo on the sniper shot. Even thought my rifle will shoot any ammo everyone really would want to use the same brand and type to make things fare. And those that are out of country and couldn't bring there own firearm or can't own a firearm, it would include the renting of my Sig (it WILL be rebuilt from factory Sig so you shouldn't have any problems this time and I'll spend the money and buy another Mag for $65.00 and try to get a left hand and right hand holster for it).

Sorry for the long post, but please people read it and think about it and let me know. It all depends on YOU how things will go and EVEN IF I'LL do it again next year.

I'd do it again, and give you money. I'd also love to run the course with an airsoft pistol, just to see if the time changes :D

[someguy]

Re: Competition Shoot for DefCon21 Shoot Event

I'll kick in $5 and bring some goodies, if I get to come next year. (I won't know until about April.)

I have target stands for two legged frames, IPSC targets and hole tapers.

Maybe we can mix brown IPSC targets with the white "plates". Rifle can even have a target WAAAAAAAY out for "one-shot-one-kill" competition.

I'm game! Gimme your PayPal address! ;-)

someguy

[seeess]

Re: Competition Shoot for DefCon21 Shoot Event

I'm fine with $5, I would be in favor of separating the rental fee from the range fee.

I'd suggest you start a new thread with a built in poll so you dont have to track individual replies to the thread. You may get more votes if you start it on next year's thread since they lock these in a few months.

[TheSiscoCoon]

Re: Competition Shoot for DefCon21 Shoot Event

Edit: Sorry for those of you that where there and the whole thing about those 2 people that passed away. FYI: I raised my flash and drank to them even thought I didn't know them. I wasn't complaining about the long time because of that.

truly awesome work on the part of SiscoCoon for putting this together and everyone who participated. i'm sorry that i didn't get to announce the results during the main closing (they shifted everyone to a separate "contest results closing" the hour before) but i did rattle off the results in that room for anyone who was there.

Sucks....I didn't find out about that til just after the 1 1/2hr closing thing. I think they could have had time if they didn't focus almost 1 hr on those retiring from working DefCon. No offense it is awesome to hear people putting so much time into DefCon and all. But that alone messed up there main event closing time frame they wanted to reach. It's cool to hear of how much work people put into things, but I think people would have rather seen the thing go 2hrs long if they where announcing winners and describing contests. Oh well...

Well I plan on being there next year and having a few new changes for running my course. This time I will know much more ahead of time if it is a for sure and have registered it as an event of DefCon. Either way I'm going to do a sniper shot with my rifle at the end. Or I may do a contest where people pay to enter to try to win free entry to DefCon or something like that. Not sure yet, it all depends on what happens before DefCon.

I would like to make kind of a poll right now if people don't mind. It was suggested to me to charge a small amount of money like $5.00 to run my course for next year since I spent so much of my own money to do it this year. Honestly I don't mind the money too much, but IF I DID charge, the money would go to the cost in materials to create more targets and the consumables required (paints paper and maybe even targets and such as in cardboard). If I collected more money than was used for the years event I would donate the rest to what Charity the masses decided on (EFF,etc). What does everyone think about that?

Would you guys pay like $5.00 to run my competition, that of course would count for shooting my ammo on the sniper shot. Even thought my rifle will shoot any ammo everyone really would want to use the same brand and type to make things fare. And those that are out of country and couldn't bring there own firearm or can't own a firearm, it would include the renting of my Sig (it WILL be rebuilt from factory Sig so you shouldn't have any problems this time and I'll spend the money and buy another Mag for $65.00 and try to get a left hand and right hand holster for it).

Sorry for the long post, but please people read it and think about it and let me know. It all depends on YOU how things will go and EVEN IF I'LL do it again next year.

[Deviant Ollam]

Re: Competition Shoot for DefCon21 Shoot Event

truly awesome work on the part of SiscoCoon for putting this together and everyone who participated. i'm sorry that i didn't get to announce the results during the main closing (they shifted everyone to a separate "contest results closing" the hour before) but i did rattle off the results in that room for anyone who was there.

[TheSiscoCoon]

Re: Competition Shoot for DefCon21 Shoot Event

Okay here are the results for the Event.

Rifle Class:

#1 - "Seeess" (M16 Full Auto with a M4-2000 Silencer Cal. 223)
Score: 18
Finish Time: 1min 38sec


Hand Gun Class:

#1 - "SomeGuy" (Custom built Colt 1911 Cal. 9mm)
Score: 18
Finish Time: 2min 17sec

#2 - "TheSiscoCoon" (Rock Island Armory 1911 Cal. 45ACP)
Score: 14
Finish Time: 2min 3sec

#3 - Rance (Glock 19 Cal. 9mm)
Score: 9
Finish Time: 2min 9sec

#4 - "FirmWarez" (CZ-75 Cal. 9mm)
Score: 3
Finish Time: 2min 3sec


Other Class (Which was all Shooters borrowing my Sig Sauer Mosquito 22LR which was acting up.. Sorry about that)

#1 - "BoomBox"
Score: 18
Finish Time: 2min 6sec

#2 - "Rewtd"
Score: 12
Finish Time: 3min 4sec

#3 - Caspian "Kil Keny"
Score: 8
Finish Time: 3min 7sec

[TheSiscoCoon]

Re: Competition Shoot for DefCon21 Shoot Event

Cool, so just to be clear this means you gave the results to deviant to hopefully read them at closing?

Deviant retweeted my video running the course, they're rushed for time but he could play that while he is giving his talk.

Yes I emailed the results to both Pry0 and Deviant yesterday afternoon. If he will play the video he should let the "powers to be" know that, they may want him to come up and announce the results for sure. I hope he explains in at the least that the course was designed to be easy yet still confuse the shooter. You could have easily gotten to the next box running that way but I wanted people to turn around and kind of go backwards.

FYI you where not the only one that was confused by that. Even though people walked the course before they ran it. And not re-holstering cuts a lot of time, that is one of the reasons why I didn't lump everyone in one class. Actually only you and I actually RAN the course, you did run faster than me however and your longer legs sure did help.

Thanks again for your support

[seeess]

Re: Competition Shoot for DefCon21 Shoot Event

I will post the results on here Sunday Evening after they are announced.

Cool, so just to be clear this means you gave the results to deviant to hopefully read them at closing?

Deviant retweeted my video running the course, they're rushed for time but he could play that while he is giving his talk.

[TheSiscoCoon]

Re: Competition Shoot for DefCon21 Shoot Event

Quick update...

Shot the course and it was real fun! Sisco is a pretty cool guy and we stood around and talked for a long time.

If he decides to try the again next year, I'll see what can do to help and support him in doing it.

Sisco: were you going to post the results here?

Again, thanks for the fun! Job well done!

someguy

Thanks for the compliment SomeGuy, it was very interesting talking with you too and seeing your custom built colt 9mm 1911.

I don't think many people can say for sure where they will be in a year from now. But if I'm still around I'll do it again next year with some other neat ideas and changes. I may also offer 1 or 2 free passes into DefCon as a prize for the winners, but don't hold me to that because I'm not sure if I'll be able to get them.

I will post the results on here Sunday Evening after they are announced.

Thanks again SomeGuy, all this I know you already know because I PMed you about this already but for the rest of the people....now you know.

Thanks everyone!!

[someguy]

Re: Competition Shoot for DefCon21 Shoot Event

Quick update...

Shot the course and it was real fun! Sisco is a pretty cool guy and we stood around and talked for a long time.

If he decides to try the again next year, I'll see what can do to help and support him in doing it.

Sisco: were you going to post the results here?

Again, thanks for the fun! Job well done!

someguy

[TheSiscoCoon]

Re: Competition Shoot for DefCon21 Shoot Event

Not arguing the point. Just clarifying.

You've taken on a hell of a task and done very well for the constraints involved.

You DO move with a loaded weapon. You do NOT reholster the live weapon in a course fire.

Moving with a loaded weapon is ALWAYS the most dangerous part and where most AD's occur. BUT, reholstering a weapon, under stress, is considered more dangerous.

I understand that this is not an IDPA or USPSA match, but they are organizations who have put a lot of thought and experience into the safety of these sorts of actions.

I'm not sure if I'm going to come out and play this year. I'm usually a "helper". Deviant will vouch for me. But this year has been crazy for me and I'm considering simplifying my DefCon trip by leaving guns at home.

If I come, I will help. I might even shoot. I don't have a lane or anything and it depends on whether I decide to pack my junk.

Either way, I appreciate your work to bring a new facet of fun to the DefCon shoot!

Thanks!
someguy
(If I don't make the shoot, and I can find you - I'll buy you a drink!)

Thanks for the complement, it is hard work and took some money but I enjoy watching people have fun via my efforts. I understand TOTALY the extra cost of bringing your guns and with Deviants tent setup and times that people paid for. That is why I decided to start my thing long before his times and probly even after his event so that EVERYONE has a chance to run the course. That is why I'm getting to the shoot sight tomorrow afternoon. Right now I want it simple and easy for everyone and is why I'm offering one of my guns for ANYONE (of legal age) to use for the course if they want too. I'm even providing Eyes & Ears, holster everything, the only thing I ask is if you want to borrow my gun for the course to please at least download the paperwork and print out and glue your targets so i don't have to make a ton of them.

So if you want you can bring your targets and use my Sig to run the course which would cut your cost of bringing your own firearms. And I plan on helping Deviant setup his tents as well which is another reason why I'm getting there early so I can be setup and ready to go long before deviant, that way I would have the time to help him. I'm actually camping on-site tomorrow night and should be there by tomorrow afternoon PST. So print up some targets and fill out the form and bring with you and use my gun. The only downside with my gun is I only have 1 Mag for it (10rds). I may take a vote depending on those that want to use my gun, I may pause the stop watch and let the person reload and then start the time back up if they want to do 2 shots fired at each target, or just do one shot at each target. If you borrow my gun it would be Classed as "Other" though so all things are fare with points and all.

And yes there is ALWAYS a risk when handling ANY firearm. But if your re-holstering your gun your likely only to shoot yourself rather than myself or someone else. Shooting yourself is NOT what I'm trying to really protect (no I don't want ANYONE to get shot). Keep in mind YOU WILL BE RUNNING and not only that you WILL BE running on uneven ground with rocks and in the bushes!!!! I've already scouted the area and I know where I'll be setting things up at. If your LOADED GUN is in your hand you could easily trip and the gun could go off. It's far less likely going to go off in the holster if you trip. I will also instruct each shooter before they run the course on basic gun safety and proper use! Safety is my NUMBER ONE GOAL!!! NOT how fast your are or how good you are.

As a side note: The moving with a loaded weapon in hand has been discussed somewhat with the powers to be above Deviant I believe. There was some concern about running with a loaded weapon and that most of the injuries with law enforcement training was during moving action with a loaded weapon. Which I saw a problem before this was brought up by the powers to be. Which is why EVERYONE will re-holster the weapon BEFORE they MOVE out of the shooters box. There should be NO DIFFERENCE between that and you holstering your CCW everyday!!! Then you can start running. I know this is not like other competitions but think of it this way, it's GREAT practice on drawing your weapon when it is needed if your a CCW carry person.

Drink is not needed but thanks very much for the offer.

[someguy]

Re: Competition Shoot for DefCon21 Shoot Event

Not arguing the point. Just clarifying.

You've taken on a hell of a task and done very well for the constraints involved.

You DO move with a loaded weapon. You do NOT reholster the live weapon in a course fire.

Moving with a loaded weapon is ALWAYS the most dangerous part and where most AD's occur. BUT, reholstering a weapon, under stress, is considered more dangerous.

I understand that this is not an IDPA or USPSA match, but they are organizations who have put a lot of thought and experience into the safety of these sorts of actions.

I'm not sure if I'm going to come out and play this year. I'm usually a "helper". Deviant will vouch for me. But this year has been crazy for me and I'm considering simplifying my DefCon trip by leaving guns at home.

If I come, I will help. I might even shoot. I don't have a lane or anything and it depends on whether I decide to pack my junk.

Either way, I appreciate your work to bring a new facet of fun to the DefCon shoot!

Thanks!
someguy
(If I don't make the shoot, and I can find you - I'll buy you a drink!)

You said you NEVER move with a loaded gun. A little confusing but i think I get your meaning. Here is the problem and why I'm demanding the re-holstering. when you add movement and action with a loaded gun there is a chance of firing off a round with out meaning too. That is the safety problem!!! This is not an official USPSA, IDPA event, you do not have to pay a fee to enter the contest, the event is not insured if you shoot yourself or someone else. This is some guy (Me) setting up targets for EVERYONE to shoot at making it into a contest for FUN!! If this was an official event and insured against such things I would be doing it different.

I'm sorry the re-holstering/re-slinging your firearm is a MUST, no if ands or buts. I don't feel like getting shot and relying on the person who shot me to pay for my medical bills. I get the feeling you don't like getting timed for the re-holstering thing, but keep in mind EVERYONE will be doing the same thing. Rifles are not in the same class has Hand Guns, there will be TWO winners one for each Class. Keep in mind as well this is just for FUN and I want to make it easy, safe, and fun for everyone to enjoy.

And yes time will be counted but it's not the only thing that counts. Accuracy counts alot!!!! So what if you finish the course in 3min and do it faster than everyone else. It doesn't count for anything if you didn't hit many targets. Accuracy is what really counts for THIS years course, time is just to settle things if 2 people get the same score in points. And there is NO TIME LIMIT to complete the course, you can take as long as you want to shoot all your targets and can even walk to each target if you want too.

If your unsure about the course and would like to see it first before you do it your welcome to watch and see. I'm assuming your going to be bringing a gun of some sort. Just bring a holster, extra Mag (there good to have for your gun anyways), and 10 printed targets if you can. I will have some for people but I can't supple everyone with targets (I may be able to glue new printed targets on the old card board, will help if it works). If you like the course then your all set if you bring those few things.

Does that help you out, or are there still other questions about it? FYI I will only be able to answer questions on the forum up to tonight. After that I'll be on the road driving to the Shoot site to setup everything. I'm leave at 5am PST, after tonight you will have to sent your questions to my email address (The_Sisco_Coon@yahoo.com) and hope that between spots in the Desert I can answer them for you.

Thanks and I hope to see you out there even though you will have to re-holster your firearm :(

[TheSiscoCoon]

Re: Competition Shoot for DefCon21 Shoot Event

Am still intrigued BUT...

Is the time required to holster and move to the next shooting area part of the scored time?

In competition (USPSA, IDPA), you NEVER RE-holster and move with a loaded gun.

someguy

You said you NEVER move with a loaded gun. A little confusing but i think I get your meaning. Here is the problem and why I'm demanding the re-holstering. when you add movement and action with a loaded gun there is a chance of firing off a round with out meaning too. That is the safety problem!!! This is not an official USPSA, IDPA event, you do not have to pay a fee to enter the contest, the event is not insured if you shoot yourself or someone else. This is some guy (Me) setting up targets for EVERYONE to shoot at making it into a contest for FUN!! If this was an official event and insured against such things I would be doing it different.

I'm sorry the re-holstering/re-slinging your firearm is a MUST, no if ands or buts. I don't feel like getting shot and relying on the person who shot me to pay for my medical bills. I get the feeling you don't like getting timed for the re-holstering thing, but keep in mind EVERYONE will be doing the same thing. Rifles are not in the same class has Hand Guns, there will be TWO winners one for each Class. Keep in mind as well this is just for FUN and I want to make it easy, safe, and fun for everyone to enjoy.

And yes time will be counted but it's not the only thing that counts. Accuracy counts alot!!!! So what if you finish the course in 3min and do it faster than everyone else. It doesn't count for anything if you didn't hit many targets. Accuracy is what really counts for THIS years course, time is just to settle things if 2 people get the same score in points. And there is NO TIME LIMIT to complete the course, you can take as long as you want to shoot all your targets and can even walk to each target if you want too.

If your unsure about the course and would like to see it first before you do it your welcome to watch and see. I'm assuming your going to be bringing a gun of some sort. Just bring a holster, extra Mag (there good to have for your gun anyways), and 10 printed targets if you can. I will have some for people but I can't supple everyone with targets (I may be able to glue new printed targets on the old card board, will help if it works). If you like the course then your all set if you bring those few things.

Does that help you out, or are there still other questions about it? FYI I will only be able to answer questions on the forum up to tonight. After that I'll be on the road driving to the Shoot site to setup everything. I'm leave at 5am PST, after tonight you will have to sent your questions to my email address (The_Sisco_Coon@yahoo.com) and hope that between spots in the Desert I can answer them for you.

Thanks and I hope to see you out there even though you will have to re-holster your firearm :(