general question

[denderah]

like many things i read or come across they are new to me. i read an older tiny article on winnowing and in the article the author stated that the reason for winnowing was to transmit information with confidentiality without using encryption. the authors reason for not using encryption was due to government restrictions regulating encryption. how do the two compare in their ability to provide confidential information and which is easier or more practical to implement and why? what government restrictions exist that would cause users to use one over the other? the article was fairly old so i dont know if winnowing is common use or how relevant winnowing was/is/has become if at all or how relevant my question is. thanks for letting me post.

~denderah

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here is a 51 syllable poem called 52224
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i is kinetic.
energy. distance between.
us, only varies.

when is potential.
where is there that no one sees.
both negates time cease.

one is prophetic.
two? more than one knows not three.
three links fifty ones.
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[TheCotMan]

i read an older tiny article on winnowing and in the article the author stated that the reason for winnowing was to transmit information with confidentiality without using encryption. the authors reason for not using encryption was due to government restrictions regulating encryption. how do the two compare in their ability to provide confidential information?

Like encryption, I would estimate that winnowing is as secure as you want to make it. Steganography is/was a hot topic for alternatives to standard crypto (or used in addition to standard crypto) but there was a nice presentation at DefCon that provided a review of different implementations of steganography that showed some people's designs were less than acceptable. (Leaving keywords/passphrases/words at the end of an image in plain-text, or violating rules for the image in order to store information used to aid in getting information back from an image.)
A huge factor is implementation.

A second factor, is your requested comparison is too broad for a technical review. (Which is faster, red cars or blue cars?) Say I want to compare winnowing against a vernam cipher where both sides have exchanged an infinite number of keys in a secure fashion? Best that winnowing could do would be to tie my selection for an encryption cipher.

A weakness in winnowing? similar to conventional encryption: key exchange.
Marks for crypto: tried and tested for a long time, banks and governments have trusted lives and large sums of money to conventional encryption for a long time.
Marks for winnowing, chaffing, and similar methods to hide data: fewer laws that address these and make them illegal.
Marks against winnowing: it may suddenly become illegal when laws catch up to it, or regulated into insecurity-- risky for building an infrastructure around.

which is easier or more practical to implement and why?

Standard encryption is more practical, as there are specific laws, regulations, standards, and a wealth of libs and support in applications that use it. e.g.: How many apps/services support DES? How many support some form of winnowing? How many development libs are available for some cipher that uses conventional encryption? Easier and more practical to use conventional encryption.

What government restrictions exist that would cause users to use one over the other?

If your government prohibits encryption (and has it legally defined to not include winnowing, steganography, chaffing, etc.) then you may be able to add security to your content until new laws are added. Others can name specific governments that have laws against their people using encryption.

the article was fairly old so i dont know if winnowing is common use or how relevant winnowing was/is/has become if at all or how relevant my question is. thanks for letting me post.

We have crypto people on this forum, as they have exposed their knowledge in other posts. Let's see if this question provokes more responses. :-)

[LosT]

We have crypto people on this forum, as they have exposed their knowledge in other posts. Let's see if this question provokes more responses. :-)

That was too cryptic a hint....

No replies will follow :P


LosT

[TheCotMan]

That was too cryptic a hint....
No replies will follow :P

But you replied to me, and I just replied to you!
Woohoo! I get a double score for being a troublemaker!
Why is my "troublemaker score" spelled "a-s-s-h-a-t score"? Who has been messin' with the scoreboard?

What I was trying to say was this:
I know there are crypto people here on these forums because they have offered hints on this in their other posts.

It was meant to be praise, not condemnation.

Why didn't I offer any specific names?

I don't want skilled people upset with me for referring other people with questions to them.

[Voltage Spike]

the authors reason for not using encryption was due to government restrictions regulating encryption.

As I understand, exporting cryptography is mostly legal in the United States these days. After all, what good are restrictions now that practically-unbreakable cryptography is available to everyone that wants it?

It's a weird question, though: cryptography and winnowing are generally orthogonal concepts. Why not just use them together?

[denderah]

area 51

im grateful to hear opinions on my weak ass topic, thanks!
on another topic..........................did anyone like my poem?
i thought it was nice
-i appriciate your responses very much,
-i understand what you mean about generalized comparison vs actuality.











3X17=51 51X1024=52224
dumb but cool

[Voltage Spike]

did anyone like my poem?

Well, I'll admit they were three haikus.

[noid]

Save the poetry for livejournal.

[Floydr47]

We have crypto people on this forum, as they have exposed their knowledge in other posts. Let's see if this question provokes more responses. :-)

I knew some crypto people when I was in the Army...very, very, very scary people, or maybe it was just the brand of tobacco I was smoking at the time...

[TheCotMan]

I knew some crypto people when I was in the Army...very, very, very scary people...

The few I have met have a wicked sense of humor, sharp wit, and are generally fun to be around-- unless you provoke them. Maybe some day, I'll get into crypto.