my response to :I-hacked article on hiding lockpicks from TSA...

[Deviant Ollam]

Re: my response to :I-hacked article on hiding lockpicks from TSA...

Im sure I passed through some states where it wouldnt have been okay for me to get caught with them.

the law seems to change a fair amount, sadly. back when i first put my presentation together there were only a few specific states that i called "states of concern" for relatively minor reasons. now it seems like people report to me more and more about places where lockpicks are allegedly not cool. i'll have to do some serious research to figure out what's what. ah well, i'm not going to stop carrying mine.

I really freaked out the first few times they searched the bus

do they routinely search buses in long, interstate journeys? i've never ridden on one like that so i have no experience there. that sounds creepy. what manner of search is performed and by what body of individuals, if i may ask? are we talking TSA-style bag scanners or local P.D. looking for "unsavory" people to hassle, etc?

I am on my second lock since I bought several locks the other day

good for you! keep it up and you may find yourself a new hobby that you get really into. maybe we'll see you at a TOOOL meeting sometime.

I've never flown before, so thanks for letting me know that I wont get molested at an airport just for having a lockpick set.

heh, nah... you don't have to worry so much about the picks in that scenario. the airport staff is always coming up with newer and more comical ways of molesting you so i'm sure that by the time you opt to fly, they'll have instituted some sort of "no hair care product" rule (or something equally asinine) and get in your face for not just using a scrunchy or hair clip.

[faye]

Re: my response to :I-hacked article on hiding lockpicks from TSA...

I bought my first set this Defcon and having traveled by bus and passing through every state from Nevada to Texas, Im sure I passed through some states where it wouldnt have been okay for me to get caught with them... so I really freaked out the first few times they searched the bus....but I thought about it and if I ever did get caught with them and asked what I use them for, I would have to say I use them more as a toothpick to get stuff out of my permanent retainer and to get stuff out from underneath my long acrylic nails. (not the same tool of course) They can usually tell when someone is lying or hiding something anyway, so I feel it wouldnt be a problem because its true....though I am on my second lock since I bought several locks the other day ; P

But Deviant Ollam's post and others seem to make me think that you'll only have trouble if you start it.
btw I've never flown before, so thanks for letting me know that I wont get molested at an airport just for having a lockpick set. ; )

[Schuyler]

Re: my response to :I-hacked article on hiding lockpicks from TSA...

If I have a competition the day or day after I arrive, I carry-on and have never had an issue, though curiosity abounds and the person checking usually has to ask someone for confirmation that I'm OK to fly. If I don't have to compete I check them with my luggage to avoid the hold-up in the line. In general I like to make people's jobs easier. Only reason I don't check every time is the obvious lost-luggage scenario, which did happen my first year in Holland, happily we had a couple of days before the Open and my luggage was delivered before it went down.

[DaKahuna]

Re: my response to :I-hacked article on hiding lockpicks from TSA...

My SouthOrd set is shaped like a folding knife and I had forgotten that it was in my backpack. TSA at Dulles picked it up on their scanner and I underwent a bag search. The TSA dude was not able to figure out how to open it so I asked him if it was okay for me to show him. He was cool about it and let me open it, give it back to him and the he asked me to close it again and then he opened it for himself. He seemed to be please with himself that he was able to do it by himself the 2nd time.

I am just happy that he was not very familiar with Virginia law which makes it illegal to carry a lockpick set unless you are a licensed locksmith.

[erehwon]

Re: my response to :I-hacked article on hiding lockpicks from TSA...

Only problem I had with TSA was flying out, the golden retrievers at MKE thought my SouthOrd kit was a metal mini-umbrella, they were cool about it after giving them a nice feel with their fingertips. Nice to see where the priorities are with TSA as bamboo or plastic knitting needles are OK to fly with. Defcon Knitting Group anyone?

Flying back from LAS, I had more trouble with my laptop being on top of my wingtips than anything else.

[valanx]

Re: my response to :I-hacked article on hiding lockpicks from TSA...

I've flown with many ridiculous objects in my day and I haven't had to conceal anything like I was a heroin mule. Hiding your picks like that only begs for TSA to then strip every single item you have down to its bare essentials to see if you are hiding something else as well.

All in all, a generally dense thing to do for something that the TSA isn't going to hassle you over in the first place. I normally check my gear, but that's because it is with the rest of my locks, walls, and other crap. I've been known to split up picks in case a bag gets lost, but I'm not ready to make a hollow compartment in my shoe or anything.

I walked through the checkpoint this time with a bag FULL of every lock you saw on the lock walls this year, along with various parts and pieces. One guy must have thought a doorknob looked like a gun, but I did enjoy the girl taking it over to him after looking in my bag and saying "Really? You were worried about THIS?"

TSA and just about any other security group is much less likely to commit high crimes of asshattery if you say "those are my lockpicks and locks for some demonstrations I'm giving" other than playing James Bond. Though should you get your picks confiscated and still make it to an upcoming con, don't worry. Someone will sell you some more picks. I hear TOOOL has a nice set.

[Deviant Ollam]

Re: my response to :I-hacked article on hiding lockpicks from TSA...

yeah, my email to hevnsnt read basically...

Sorry to sound like a downer... but the individual who contributed the "How to Sneak Lockpicks into your Carry-On Bag" was wrong about a lot of their facts and gave some generally difficult advice.

First of all, lockpicks are totally allowed on planes (at least domestically) as long as they are not part of a kit with a blade or other larger tool that could be considered a dangerous implement. Smaller "jacknife" style sets often LOOK like banned items on x-ray machines, but they aren't. You just have to open them and show that they are simply picks.

Picks (even hard-tempered expert ones like a John Falle set or some high-end Peterson models) aren't stiff enough and thick enough to hurt anyone. You can't slash or jab with them. They aren't weapons and thus aren't banned.

HOWEVER, encouraging someone to put ANYTHING in their bags in a "concealed" manner is just asking for them to have trouble at security. The method shown in the article is great if you wanna get drugs or something through security (where you're completely fucked anyway if they catch you at all) but is just stupid to do with lockpicks or other legal items.

If security DOES see the item and wants to inspect it, you'll be hassled unnecessarily as they disassemble your bag, etc. Then you have to explain why you're hiding something at all, even if it's legal, possibly resulting in more searches or at the very least a stern talking-to and possibly a record in a security log somewhere.

Overall, just fly with your shit like an adult or mail it ahead of time if you're that paranoid. Keep the hidden compartments for your reefer or $10K+ in financial instruments.

[TheCotMan]

Re: my response to :I-hacked article on hiding lockpicks from TSA...

If you really don't want to look suspicious and don't want to hide your stuff, there's always the US Post Office and Priority mail.

...

Agreed. Using UPS, USPS, or FedEx is undervalued for moving a lot of things to DC and other spots.

The voice of dissention! (me)

When dealing with the USPS if sending lock picking tools to the US or from the US using a while domestic path, or an international path, there are laws that govern the shipment of locksmith supplies IF you are not "supposed" to "mail" such tools -- regardless of local state laws that say it is ok to possess such tools even if you are not a locksmith.

If you are not a locksmith and purchasing from a locksmith supplier, use FedEx or UPS.

CITATION1

...
11.10.4 Locksmithing Device—Definition
A locksmithing device is:
(a). A device or tool (other than a key) designed to manipulate the tumblers in a lock into the unlocked position through the keyway of such lock.
(b). A device or tool (other than a key or a device or tool under 11.10.4a) designed for bypassing a lock or similar security device, or for opening it by a method normally not used by consumers to open such locks or security devices.
(c). A device or tool designed for making an impression of a key or similar security device to duplicate such key or device.
11.10.5 Nonmailable
Any locksmithing device, as defined in 11.10.4, is nonmailable, unless sent to any of the following:
(a). Lock manufacturer or distributor.
(b). Bona fide locksmith.
(c). Bona fide repossessor.
(d). Motor vehicle manufacturer or dealer.
(e). Bona fide automotive repair shops or businesses.

Of course, in many states, to become a licensed locksmith you only need to pay a small fee every few years, and perhaps submit an application with fingerprint cards and pay for a background check. (Requirements vary from state to state, though many states don't even require a test of any sort.)

If you are not a locksmith, and want to ship your tools, consider using UPS or FedEx.

The above is not legal advice on how to bypass laws, but it is notice of some laws that exist. Additional laws may apply. The above is not a complete list of laws in your area, and you should research such laws on your own for your special circumstances. Contest is not open to friends of family members of employees. Actual results may vary. Objects in mirror are larger or smaller than they appear. Before starting any regiment, consult your physician. Not to be taken orally. Do not eat. This is not a step. Keep hands and arms away from moving blades. No parking. Tow away zone. The white zone is for loading and unloading of passengers, only. The usual disclaimer still exists: IANAL (I Am Not A Lawyer)

[Thorn]

Re: my response to :I-hacked article on hiding lockpicks from TSA...

If you really don't want to look suspicious and don't want to hide your stuff, there's always the US Post Office and Priority mail.

Agreed. Using UPS, USPS, or FedEx is undervalued for moving a lot of things to DC and other spots.

[DJ Jackalope]

Picture this: You've got a flight to Vegas. Your craptastic airline just started charging cash for ALL checked luggage, and you planned on traveling light anyways. Your goal: participate in the lock-picking festivities at DefCon 16. The problem? Lockpicks are not only sharpened metal, but illegal to just carry around with you all over the place. They'd probably be okay in checked luggage, but as such, tucking them into a pocket of your carry-on bag and hoping for the best sounds like a good way to get a full cavity search by some under-paid TSA noobtard, if not arrested.

from i-hacked.com

Wow. I just saw this...and I'm sorry, just started laughing. I think taking apart your carry on luggage to sneak some lockpicks in would just like...immediately get your ejected from the plane and on the no fly list about as fast as it took you to put them there. It makes you look suspicious immediately and in my opinion, would be downright foolish. What intent are you really trying to hide?

Your goal is not to look suspicious and not to give anyone reason for thinking you are up to malicious activities.

I fly with one of the TOOOL emergency lockpick kits and one of the standard Southord kits from time to time, and the only time I've been stopped so far by TSA in the carry on line was this TSA guy saying "wow, those are lockpicks? Cool! You can go."

I'm not saying that they aren't questionable, and aren't illegal to have in certain states, but as far as I could see on my search of the TSA banned list they aren't on there, either.

If you really don't want to look suspicious and don't want to hide your stuff, there's always the US Post Office and Priority mail.

My .02.