Foursquare Defcon badge(s)

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  • barkode
    Member
    • Jul 2002
    • 83

    #16
    Re: Foursquare Defcon badge(s)

    The minute you bought your first cell phone, you traded your location privacy away for convenience. You're doing it -right now-. You have no location privacy. If you simultaneously have a cell phone and complain about location privacy, you're a hypocrite.

    Having already applied simple critical thinking skills to understand this fundamental truth, by and large, the LA, Seattle and NYC crews that I most often socialize with use the shit out of Foursquare, and before that Britekite, and before that Dodgeball. Ultimately this will probably switch to Facebook when they announce "place" support, but who knows.

    Hell, a lot of people also use Google Latitude and broadcast their whereabouts to friends when they're out running around.

    It frequently enables people to run into each other when they're at nearby venues. This happens with impressive frequency. It was great at RSA in San Francisco to keep track of what parties everyone was at, so you could get around and see everybody.

    From a privacy perspective - I call absolute, unequivocal and unapologetic bullshit on the entire "Please Rob Me" thing. There are a million ways other than Foursquare and location-awareness that you can tell someone isn't home. Any information someone has about someone not being home helps (like mail piling up, lights off, watching them leave for work, etc), and none of those things require you to actually know the person ahead of time.

    If someone wants to rob you, they can just sit outside your house, wait for you to leave, and break in. There is nothing you can do to stop this from happening other than not leaving the house. If someone even slightly motivated wants to break into your house, they are going to do so. Period. Get an alarm system, a dog, a shotgun, and hope for the best.

    If you're going to take a position against location awareness (Foursquare or otherwise) simply on the basis of trying to keep your whereabouts hidden from "the man" or "bad guys", well, you better also turn off your cellphone, stop posting to Internet forums about what you're up to, stop spending money, stop leaving the house, and essentially stop participating in society. Otherwise, you're a hypocrite who doesn't truly understand the situation, hopping on the "me too" train to Poorly-Informed station in Paranoidtown.

    If you don't want to use Foursquare because you don't think it practically benefits your social life, then don't use it. That's a perfectly valid reason.

    Otherwise, the hypocrisy and utter lack of pragmatism with regards to the implications of location-awareness makes me facepalm. ("I'd never use Foursquare! It tells people where I am and that's an invasion of my privacy, I could be robbed! P.S. I'll be out of town at DEFCON this year for four whole days, and I just tweeted about how I'm over at a friend's house and I'm gonna stay here and watch a movie for several hours! Oh, and my cell phone is on and hitting towers, giving thousands of people at the phone company as well as every law enforcement agency in the country access to my location within about 100 meters!")

    It is impractical for me, or anyone for that matter, to assume that they can keep people from knowing when they leave the house, locate them with great accuracy if needed, or follow them around town should they be sufficiently motivated. Therefore, I'm fine with location-aware social programs, because I might as well have an upside.

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    • Thorn
      Easy Bake Oven Iron Chef
      • Sep 2002
      • 1819

      #17
      Re: Foursquare Defcon badge(s)

      Originally posted by barkode
      The minute you bought your first cell phone, you traded your location privacy away for convenience. You're doing it -right now-. You have no location privacy. If you simultaneously have a cell phone and complain about location privacy, you're a hypocrite.

      ... <snipped for space>

      It is impractical for me, or anyone for that matter, to assume that they can keep people from knowing when they leave the house, locate them with great accuracy if needed, or follow them around town should they be sufficiently motivated. Therefore, I'm fine with location-aware social programs, because I might as well have an upside.
      Not that what you've said isn't without some merit, but it does make several assumptions, such as always having a cell phone with you. The point is that you don't have to always broadcast your location, and taking some very minimal steps can greatly mitigate that information. Keeping people from not knowing where you are doesn't have to be impractical, if you're willing to not be located at all times.

      As to it having an any kind of upside, I just don't see it. Of course, like I said previously, I don't tell anyone - including family- where I am much of the time. I just don't have a need for that kind of 24/7 social contact.
      Thorn
      "If you can't be a good example, then you'll just have to be a horrible warning." - Catherine Aird

      Comment

      • barkode
        Member
        • Jul 2002
        • 83

        #18
        Re: Foursquare Defcon badge(s)

        Originally posted by Thorn
        Not that what you've said isn't without some merit, but it does make several assumptions, such as always having a cell phone with you. The point is that you don't have to always broadcast your location, and taking some very minimal steps can greatly mitigate that information. Keeping people from not knowing where you are doesn't have to be impractical, if you're willing to not be located at all times.
        This is true - if you choose to be "off the grid", you aren't participating in the privacy/convenience tradeoff. Personally I can't really live my life like that, but that's a personal decision for me.

        On the other hand, if you do have a cell phone with you, you're on the grid, and your location information is available to a lot of people, the least of which isn't the phone company, law enforcement, and every hacker that works at the phone company. :)

        Now, that's a compartmentalized privacy tradeoff - they have the info, but the "world" doesn't, so to speak. Sort of like how your bank knows how much money you have. I get that.

        I'm simply choosing to extend the compartment to include my friends and family. If I'm giving my location info to the phone company and so on as a part of the privacy/convenience tradeoff, I might as well have an upside.

        Originally posted by Thorn
        As to it having an any kind of upside, I just don't see it. Of course, like I said previously, I don't tell anyone - including family- where I am much of the time. I just don't have a need for that kind of 24/7 social contact.
        See, now that's a perfectly valid reason not to participate. You don't need the social benefit. That makes total sense. (I don't participate in twitter for a number of personal reasons, although one day I may have to bite the bullet for convenience.)

        Comment

        • tendency
          chick
          • Jun 2004
          • 4

          #19
          Re: Foursquare Defcon badge(s)

          man i need to top typing when under the influence of my sleeping aids.
          Last edited by tendency; March 28, 2010, 08:23. Reason: sleeping pill fuelled asshattery

          Comment

          • tardissauce
            Member
            • Feb 2010
            • 16

            #20
            Re: Foursquare Defcon badge(s)

            @theprez98 - hahaha! I can totally understand how that would get old, fast! I think the app itself is a bit more purposeful when used in larger urban areas (NYC, DC, SF, LA etc) as there are just more people using it.

            @barkode - Thanks for the articulate response regarding security and location-awareness of social apps. Many of my friends use foursquare. It's been really beneficial when I'm out at conferences or even for the night to find other people I know. Recently, I had to go to this conference for work alone (read: bored) and found out via foursquare that someone I knew was there. Made the whole conference that much more bearable. Hell, i've even used it to find good places to eat based on spots people have commented on or frequent. My hope from posting in the forum is to find the folks that are using the app at defcon and get together some ideas.

            Comment

            • YenTheFirst
              Member
              • Aug 2008
              • 282

              #21
              Re: Foursquare Defcon badge(s)

              Having observed, but not used, services such as foursquare & gowalla, I wonder: would multiple 'sub-places' be created at defcon for people to check-in to? or would there just be a generic 'Riviera Convention Center'?

              Plus, even if you did have granular 'places', Defcon is dense enough that just knowing someone else is in the same talk, or the same room as you, it might not lead to you meeting up.

              I see how people use things such as Foursquare when going around town, but if you're inside the Riviera for 3 days straight, I don't see the point of checking in more than once.
              It's not stupid, it's advanced.

              Comment

              • tardissauce
                Member
                • Feb 2010
                • 16

                #22
                Re: Foursquare Defcon badge(s)

                @YenTheFirst - Yeah, I don't think it would be that granular as to exactly which talk you are in, however the villages or panels in general could be leveraged. For example at SxSW if you checked in to an early-morning panel you received the "hangover" badge. Some folks don't actually stay at the Riv so they could conceivably check-in to both their actual hotel and the con daily and a plethora of other locations around Vegas (i.e.The Double Down - best local low-key bar btw). Also, for special events like the IO party last year it would have been cool to have a badge to tie-into that (if we only would have known the roller derby girls were going to be there a "roller-skate" or "black eye" badge would have been perfect!).

                You can also try to "friend" or contact people via foursquare from their Twitter or FB (if they have the link active to their profile), so essentially you can meet people that way. I met a bunch of folks last year just from my twitter feed at defcon, one person happened to be sitting right behind me!
                Last edited by tardissauce; March 29, 2010, 08:15.

                Comment

                • erehwon
                  nowhere
                  • Dec 2001
                  • 425

                  #23
                  Re: Foursquare Defcon badge(s)

                  Time to roll this back out from the days when there was no Foursquare...

                  How to Enjoy a Convention
                  Nonnumquam cupido magnas partes Interretis vincendi me corripit

                  Comment

                  • willasaywhat
                    Member
                    • Jul 2009
                    • 115

                    #24
                    Re: Foursquare Defcon badge(s)

                    I use Foursquare, and to a point I see how people are concerned, but I still use it. My wife and I compete on the thing. It's sort of a way to get us out into the real world without ever leaving the virtual one. That said, you can in fact hide your posts. The iPhone app has a pretty distinct button for just that.

                    Now back on to the badges thing. Oh heck yes. If SXSW can get custom badges added to Foursquare why can't defcon?

                    As for usage, it'd be nice to know who's attending what talk, party, event etc. Foursquare could allow for that social interaction. Those who wish to remain anonymous are not affected, and everyone can go about their day.

                    Comment

                    • Ne0nRa1n
                      Your Jellybean of Doom
                      • Aug 2003
                      • 138

                      #25
                      Re: Foursquare Defcon badge(s)

                      Originally posted by erehwon
                      Interesting the Foursquare makes it extremely easy to point out that you're not at home, so some % of Defcon attendees are out of town, making that much easier for the local criminal element both in their hometowns and in Las Vegas to figure, well, Tardissauce is at the The Fireside Lounge at the Peppermill getting completely blotto at an industry event, its probably a good bet s/he's a good mark to clean out their hotel room, and their house, as they have marked all those locations down in the last few hours/days.
                      Doesn't posting on a public forum, like say the DEFCON forum that you are going to DEFCON make it much easier for the local criminal element in someone's hometown to figure out that the person won't be home.

                      Just saying...

                      Comment

                      • erehwon
                        nowhere
                        • Dec 2001
                        • 425

                        #26
                        Re: Foursquare Defcon badge(s)

                        Originally posted by Ne0nRa1n
                        Doesn't posting on a public forum, like say the DEFCON forum that you are going to DEFCON make it much easier for the local criminal element in someone's hometown to figure out that the person won't be home.

                        Just saying...
                        Probably, but I hope the criminal element takes into consideration the room mates, significant others, and etc that may be home while someone is bouncing around DEFCON. Don't get me wrong, my next door neighbor can be a real s$$hole at times, but he'll call the police. (and has when folks have been snooping around) at the drop of a hat.

                        Besides, I thought DEFCON was canceled?!?
                        Nonnumquam cupido magnas partes Interretis vincendi me corripit

                        Comment

                        • Ne0nRa1n
                          Your Jellybean of Doom
                          • Aug 2003
                          • 138

                          #27
                          Re: Foursquare Defcon badge(s)

                          Originally posted by erehwon
                          Besides, I thought DEFCON was canceled?!?
                          Canceled? Crap, now what am I going to do with that time I have booked off at the end of July? ;)

                          Comment

                          • erehwon
                            nowhere
                            • Dec 2001
                            • 425

                            #28
                            Re: Foursquare Defcon badge(s)

                            Originally posted by Ne0nRa1n
                            Canceled? Crap, now what am I going to do with that time I have booked off at the end of July? ;)
                            Dunno about you, but I'm going to crash RollerCon 2010 - The Roller Derby Convention, July 28, 2010 through August 01, 2010.
                            Nonnumquam cupido magnas partes Interretis vincendi me corripit

                            Comment

                            • Ne0nRa1n
                              Your Jellybean of Doom
                              • Aug 2003
                              • 138

                              #29
                              Re: Foursquare Defcon badge(s)

                              http://pleaserobme.com/

                              I thought you might all find this website amusing.

                              Comment

                              • tardissauce
                                Member
                                • Feb 2010
                                • 16

                                #30
                                Re: Foursquare Defcon badge(s)

                                Originally posted by Ne0nRa1n
                                http://pleaserobme.com/

                                I thought you might all find this website amusing.
                                Oh, now you're just being funny.

                                Comment

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