Does anybody REALLY want a DefCon CD anymore?

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  • HighWiz
    Death
    • Jun 2007
    • 655

    #16
    Re: Does anybody REALLY want a DefCon CD anymore?

    Originally posted by sk00t
    Yeah, let me clarify, the point isn't necessarily that the CD itself should go away. There are tons of neat things that can and should go on the CD, and if people enjoy a meaty piece of polycarbonate with the little smiley skeleton guy silkscreened on it, hey, so be it. In fact, if preso content were say, optional, that would clear some room for other cool stuff without forcing DCHQ to move to more-expensive DVD media.

    My point, rather, is that a lot of folks spend a lot of time scrambling to either put together content or to assemble all of that content for what is rapidly becoming a redonkulous number of talks, and that I'm not sure how many people really look at it beforehand. I also like the idea of making the ISO public right around con time - it might even be possible to publish content on the DC WLAN, though I understand that's another can of worms.
    Perhaps the poll choices should be different then? The problem with the above poll was that it was pretty much an all or nothing kind thing. Either your for it, your against, your ambivalent or you use the funny option.

    I think you may have gotten a wider array of responses had the options said what you just did. "I enjoy the CD, but would prefer being able to Download the speakers content" "I'm for the CD and think the presos should be included on there"... "I'm against the CD, and think it's a waste of resources" "I'm against the CD because... [post below]".

    I think with more options than just Yes, No, Maybe, I don't know. You'll get better responses... But that's just my two cents, YMMV.
    And I heard a voice in the midst of the four beasts, And I looked and behold: a pale horse. And his name, that sat on him, was Death. And Hell followed with him.

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    • xor
      not
      • Aug 2007
      • 1347

      #17
      Re: Does anybody REALLY want a DefCon CD anymore?

      CD == Bad
      5 minutes on the DVD burner; forever in a landfill

      ISO == Good

      The ISO should be contained on flash, encrypted with the answer to the mystery challenge, and part of the badge

      xor

      Ps If you can't burn your own cd, you most likely, aren't going to be attending Defcon. Please add to the poll, my cd is only useful to me, as an attendee, as a skeet target.
      Last edited by xor; July 4, 2010, 14:12.
      Just because you can doesn't mean you should. This applies to making babies, hacking, and youtube videos.

      Comment

      • astcell
        Human Rights Issuer
        • Oct 2001
        • 7512

        #18
        Re: Does anybody REALLY want a DefCon CD anymore?

        I will likely not look at the CD for 6 months after defcon. It's still fresh in my head. But after that I use it for reference.

        I have receives two bad CDs, one said it was blank when I tried recovery software and one was a see-through yellow I think and my CD drives cannot read it. Other than that it's the best archive I have.

        Comment

        • ChrisPaget
          Member
          • Jul 2010
          • 2

          #19
          Re: Does anybody REALLY want a DefCon CD anymore?

          (I registered here just to post this - apologies for the lack of profile :)

          A few points here from a somewhat unique perspective.

          - My 2007 presentation at Blackhat DC drew a significant legal threat from HID which my employer wasn't prepared to risk - we had to pull the talk at the last minute. We ripped apart I-don't-know-how-many hundred books and reburned all the CDs within 48 hours, and it sucked - I don't even want to think about what it would have been like for the umpteen thousand Vegas attendees. If it's a choice between including something potentially controversial or avoiding that situation right there, then sorry - you're not getting my slides. I'm done with trash-bags full of my ripped-apart content, especially when it's for something hot enough to actually get sued over :( I do at least have a really cool video of what happens when you string together 150 Blackhat CDs and hit them with a .30-06 round...

          - Why are the deadlines different for Blackhat and Defcon? There's still a full two weeks before Blackhat slides are due; 2 weeks before the con is pretty reasonable IMHO.

          - In the years I attended Defcon before speaking for the first time, I always assumed that everything on the CD was hostile. I know that a huge amount of effort goes into ensuring that's not the case, but I also know that it's not an uncommon perception - plenty of people deliberately avoid the CD and just grab what they need online.

          My suggestion: ask Joe to add a couple of Flash chips and a USB port to the badges next year. Slides and other talk-specific material goes in Flash, the CD can be filled with everything that can easily be settled in time, and the badge gets a whole lot more valuable (and only marginally more expensive). As long as everything goes up on the web promptly, you're golden...

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          • sintax_error
            DC949 Alchemist
            • Aug 2008
            • 488

            #20
            Re: Does anybody REALLY want a DefCon CD anymore?

            I'm not sure how much better putting the content on the badge would be as opposed to a CD. I would imagine that would make deadlines for submissions months ahead of time. A CD can be a hassle to toss together last minute, but we all know how long the badges take to produce. Is it really a good idea to shift the burden like that?
            "You have cubed asscheeks?"... "Do you not?"

            Comment

            • ChrisPaget
              Member
              • Jul 2010
              • 2

              #21
              Re: Does anybody REALLY want a DefCon CD anymore?

              Originally posted by sintax_error
              I'm not sure how much better putting the content on the badge would be as opposed to a CD. I would imagine that would make deadlines for submissions months ahead of time. A CD can be a hassle to toss together last minute, but we all know how long the badges take to produce. Is it really a good idea to shift the burden like that?
              I think you missed the point of using Flash media. The content would not need to be ready when the badges are designed, but rather it can be flashed into them a couple of days before the con.

              Comment

              • HighWiz
                Death
                • Jun 2007
                • 655

                #22
                Re: Does anybody REALLY want a DefCon CD anymore?

                Originally posted by ChrisPaget
                I think you missed the point of using Flash media. The content would not need to be ready when the badges are designed, but rather it can be flashed into them a couple of days before the con.
                So another thing to have to do during crunch time?

                As to your earlier point about the differences in DefCon and Blackhat, and when things are due. You do realize that one is a conference with paid staff and one is a conference that's run mostly by volunteers, right?
                And I heard a voice in the midst of the four beasts, And I looked and behold: a pale horse. And his name, that sat on him, was Death. And Hell followed with him.

                Comment

                • sintax_error
                  DC949 Alchemist
                  • Aug 2008
                  • 488

                  #23
                  Re: Does anybody REALLY want a DefCon CD anymore?

                  Originally posted by ChrisPaget
                  I think you missed the point of using Flash media. The content would not need to be ready when the badges are designed, but rather it can be flashed into them a couple of days before the con.
                  Negative there, buddy, I got exactly what you were getting at. The point I was making is that you're not likely to see a party line flashing 8000+ badges the week prior to con. It would likely need to be done during manufacturing, and even if it were to be done after the fact, they'd need to be shipped to a different facility to get it done. As usual, this is just my 2¢ and your mileage may vary, objects in mirror appear closer than they are, do not ingest rectally and do not operate while asleep.
                  "You have cubed asscheeks?"... "Do you not?"

                  Comment

                  • Ryugen
                    Unconfirmed Email
                    • Apr 2010
                    • 14

                    #24
                    Re: Does anybody REALLY want a DefCon CD anymore?

                    I for one agree with an ISO and disagree with a flash chip embbed into the badge. It would cost more to add it, and be just as much of a hassle as burning a bunch of CD's. The whole point is to give access to material that people will look at and are decently up to date. It's not about the value of the data itself. Knowledge is worth enough already, and most people wanting to learn more download it later, but a compiled ISO with a bunch of cool stuff would allow more time to add to it without burning disks, allow it to be updated, and etc, etc... That's just my opinion though.

                    Comment

                    • Metatron
                      Member
                      • Mar 2010
                      • 17

                      #25
                      Re: Does anybody REALLY want a DefCon CD anymore?

                      I like the way the CD is as it currently stands. Its seems a bit like throwing the baby out with the bathwater scrapping the idea of a CD. I would sooner have some outdated slides, then and there on the day, than having to hunt around for them or downloading them to a machine when I get home.

                      I respect the fact that a lot of time and effort goes into producing them, but I think a large percentage of people like and use them.

                      I will say I'm not entirely against the idea of having the content on a flash drive, maybe someone could sponsor them and have their logo on one side and defcon on the other. I know RSA use to send me load of them, they also use to send shitty mp3 players, they are a staple of company merchandise and have been for years.
                      Insert funny sig here

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                      • Widge
                        Member
                        • Aug 2006
                        • 8

                        #26
                        Re: Does anybody REALLY want a DefCon CD anymore?

                        Source code changes, documents change, a read only CD can only be written once. There should be a place to download code, docs, presentations, and any other fun content. A FTP site and a source repository would do me more good than a CD. Share the information you have already, make it public unless a presenter is specifically releasing code as part of their presentation. The CD is a poor way to represent changing content. A CD also has a shelf life. Down with CD's, unless they contain pr0n and malware and can be found only on the floor in public restrooms.
                        ascending bits

                        Comment

                        • ishtr
                          Member
                          • Jun 2010
                          • 6

                          #27
                          Re: Does anybody REALLY want a DefCon CD anymore?

                          Agree those poll options could use some work.

                          I've rather given up on the CD slides because most seem outdated, but I do find the other stuff useful during the Con (more survival kit!) Like an above poster, I tend to select talks from the abstracts and then download the content from the website post-con...the minute it is available. An ISO sounds like it would do the job and give everyone (speakers and staff) a break. As a frequent speaker I sympathize with reworking those slides until the last minute.

                          Badge, CD, or interpretive dance, I'm pretty indifferent about how the information gets to me so long as it's relatively fast and reasonably accurate.

                          Comment

                          • badkobold
                            Whiskey Pirates
                            • Jun 2010
                            • 39

                            #28
                            Re: Does anybody REALLY want a DefCon CD anymore?

                            I like the CD, and hope it stays. I used it during the Con and viewed it at least twice since last year.

                            Besides, it makes a sexy coaster for drinks.

                            Comment

                            • hydruh
                              Poet Philosopher
                              • Feb 2007
                              • 57

                              #29
                              Re: Does anybody REALLY want a DefCon CD anymore?

                              Originally posted by Nikita
                              Yeah, but do you care about the presentations? I think that was the real question being asked here despite the question asked. I don't think anyone wants to get rid of the "Cool" stuff: Source, contest stuff, hints, music, past con audio, etc.

                              Really, I don't care about the slides on the CD while I am there. No. I got to the talk, take notes, think about it, and get the slides later after it has sunk in through the drunken haze.

                              S

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                              • paint
                                Member
                                • Jun 2008
                                • 30

                                #30
                                Re: Does anybody REALLY want a DefCon CD anymore?

                                i wanna Defcon USB thumb drive .... with homicidal smiley faces on it ... or a braclet.. i have one from HP that is pretty kick ass.

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