DEF CON 21 Pin Giveaway!

[kallahar]

I just got the go-ahead from Dark Tangent for us to produce a lapel pin to GIVE AWAY to all attendees!

Now we just need to fund it!

We've got a proven track record of making our ideas turn into reality, so please contribute. The end cost is about $1-2 per unit, so if you give $20 then that's 10-20 attendees that you're making happy!

Any excess amount raised goes back to defcon too, this is a non-profit venture.

http://pledgie.com/campaigns/19800

Kallahar

[_abc]

Re: DEF CON 21 Pin Giveaway!

Done, need another pin to add to my bag :)

[renderman]

Re: DEF CON 21 Pin Giveaway!

I just got the go-ahead from Dark Tangent for us to produce a lapel pin to GIVE AWAY to all attendees!

Now we just need to fund it!

We've got a proven track record of making our ideas turn into reality, so please contribute. The end cost is about $1-2 per unit, so if you give $20 then that's 10-20 attendees that you're making happy!

Any excess amount raised goes back to defcon too, this is a non-profit venture.

http://pledgie.com/campaigns/19800

Kallahar

I'm in for $20

[wick2o]

Re: DEF CON 21 Pin Giveaway!

I'm in for $20 as well

[DaKahuna]

Re: DEF CON 21 Pin Giveaway!

Donated $20 as well.

[pukingmonkey]

Re: DEF CON 21 Pin Giveaway!

great idea, in for $20 as well.

[thule]

Re: DEF CON 21 Pin Giveaway!

Cool idea.
Done... $20

[YenTheFirst]

Re: DEF CON 21 Pin Giveaway!

Possibly a dumb question, but -

What is the minimum run for manufacturing the pins? If only $500 gets raised, does that mean that A) only 500 pins get produced, B) some number > 500 pins gets produced, with the rest coming out of your pocket, or C) no pins get produced, due to out-of-pocket being too much?

[kallahar]

Re: DEF CON 21 Pin Giveaway!

(c)

The only way it works is as a giveaway. To do them for-profit (or just a limited run) would mean I would have to get a vendor table, do it all business like, etc.

Kallahar

[wick2o]

Re: DEF CON 21 Pin Giveaway!

(c)

The only way it works is as a giveaway. To do them for-profit (or just a limited run) would mean I would have to get a vendor table, do it all business like, etc.

Kallahar

I think the real question was what are you were going to do with the funds if you don't raise enough to make pins.

[TheCotMan]

Re: DEF CON 21 Pin Giveaway!

I think the real question was what are you were going to do with the funds if you don't raise enough to make pins.

There is no explicit answer to the specific scenario you describe, but an implied answer is provided in the original post:

Any excess amount raised goes back to defcon too, this is a non-profit venture.

Another implicit answer to your question is on the pledgie page:

URL1=http://pledgie.com/campaigns/19800

This is a non-profit venture, any excess amount raised will be donated back to defcon.

The way I read this is like this:
* If we/they get more than $10,000 then excess is donated to DEF CON.
* If we/they get an amount that is less than or equal to $10,000 and more than or equal to what we/they would need to justify an order, then we/they will order less than the number of pins needed to cover all attendees, and give them out, first come, first served, in front of line.
* If we/they do not have enough to justify an order, then we/they will donate "excess" (what is not used to buy pins) to DEF CON.

However, where money and work is concerned, I can understand you desire for an explicit answer.

In order to get that, you'll have to wait for Kallahar.
(I'm not involved with this event, so my answers are NOT authoritative.)
(We/They is used because when we spend/donate they spend/allocate, so it is meant to include those that donate and those that are working to make this happen.)

HTH,
-Cot

[kallahar]

Re: DEF CON 21 Pin Giveaway!

OH NO!

I made the decision to stop the idea <cry>. Many people were supportive of the project, but unfortunately we were well short of the goal. Since it takes a few weeks to have these manufactured we would have had to have everything done and funded in the next few weeks, so I made the tough decision to end it now.

Everyone who has donated should have the amount refunded to their paypal account by now.

I've always liked the idea of crowd-sourcing fun ideas instead of relying on a business to provide them, but unfortunately it's tough to get people to donate on a schedule. I might do the same idea next year, but just do it as a business (ie, get a vendor table), or just do a limited run to give away. It was an interesting experiment to see if pledgie would work or not. I bet that the vast majority of defcon attendees (who would love the idea) simply don't take part in the community online, so they didn't even know this was happening.

So, thanks to everyone who supported the idea, even though it didn't come to fruition!

Kallahar

[nulltone]

Re: DEF CON 21 Pin Giveaway!

Ah, damn. That sucks, because I thought this was a cool idea and planned on supporting it (I just heard about this), even though $10,000 seems like a lofty goal for short notice, and it unfortunately is proving to be a tough goal... I am sorry to hear that is the fate of this idea, Kallahar. Maybe there are just not enough forum users around right now to get to that much, you know? Also, I hate to be the pessimist, but uh... $10,000 at $1-2 per unit wouldn't be enough for everyone, right? Last I heard, DefCon 20 was around 16,000 attendees. And even if you only had 5,000 to 10,000 pins to give away, which would be kinda cool, but not as cool, you need 500 donations by the deadline, and it sounds like that isn't going to happen with a grassroots movement.

Maybe you (or someone else) could do something similar, or the exact same, or at least keep the design alive by, asking one of the vendors or some kind of sponsor or otherwise benefactor to support it financially, but it probably could be more than $10,000 if you really want everyone to have one for free. Of course, sponsors are hard to get on short notice and vendors will want to sell it, not give it away at registration as I imagine this could have been.

But IMHO, if these cool looking pins (and good idea to give them away to everyone, but not practical without lots of donations or some other arrangement that is okay with people...) are really something like $1-2 per unit, which seems really cheap for so few units of something custom, it would be really odd for the official DefCon store not to have a pin like this, and then just turn around and sell it for $5 or something reasonable like that. Also, if you are able to carry this on as a project, it would be cool to know how/where the pins are made, or at least make sure it doesn't have anything practically harmful in the material (Chinese made scrap metal depleted uranium made pins, anyone? heh... sorry to be a jerk, but again, just being paranoid, hopefully... haha)

So, if the free pin for everyone idea can't stay alive, I think this should be in a store, perhaps the official DefCon store at the event. Hopefully there is enough time left for that... $1-2 to make pins are cool if they are decent, but if the vendor wants to get something way more per unit, because it is a fancier and well made pin, the store might charge $10 or 20. Most of all, nothing radioactive or cadmium or anything like that in the pins. Haha, sorry, but I feel like if they are to be made by some cheap and sketchy foreign company (China or anywhere cutting corners), which is possible with cheap small batches like these, it is a gamble on whether or not they will look right and whether or not they will be safe.

Even though this is a great idea, and I feel like I share your pain Kallahar, and everyone else who donated, I feel like this is something that a vendor can and should easily pick up, or a corporate/otherwise sponsor can maybe keep it free and give it away at registration, but that is, if you can find one on short notice. I don't think DefCon has ever had any official sponsors, unless I totally missed something other than a few more recent sponsored parties, so... this is kinda unchartered territory. I would imagine you can find a company to sponsor it, but what do they want in return, and how will it impact the attendees and the "overall feeling" of Defcon.

Anyway, I hope someone, Kallahar or not, tries to keep this idea alive... there has to be someone out there who is willing to fund this, or maybe it can be an official Defcon thing, vendor or free. Another idea... find someone who might be willing to pay for it in the meantime, and then ask for donations near registration (have a little box or something) as you are handing out the pin. That is actually alot more complicated and annoying, so uhm, either a vendor should pick this up (and likely make good profit) or anyone else who is prosperous and feels generous.

I hope it works out. Oh and hey, I haven't posted on the forums in a while, so hello everyone! (not meaning to de-rail thread... just saying it has been a while and hey forum people. Hey to everyone who remembers me and might be surprised to see me pop out of the shadows, heh...)

[kallahar]

Re: DEF CON 21 Pin Giveaway!

Thanks! When I picked the number I hadn't gotten an exact quote yet, at 10,000 units I think the price dropped to about $0.60/unit, so I think there would have been plenty (at least for a large chunk of the attendees).

I'm also not exactly sure what the defcon logo rules are. I don't think vendors are allowed to sell the smiley face on non-shirts. There's also lots of rules about selling excess stock, items without years on them, etc that complicate things for commercial vendors.

However, I too would love to see ideas like this come to fruition, and I encourage literally everyone with an idea to give it a shot!

Kallahar

[reminy]

Re: DEF CON 21 Pin Giveaway!

However, I too would love to see ideas like this come to fruition, and I encourage literally everyone with an idea to give it a shot!

Kallahar

I wonder if you can rent a penny press and have some custom dies made? Then you can price them for a quarter or whatever. If the numbers would be profitable, perhaps donate to EFF? I would have donated, but just heard of this today.