1337 speak

[Floydr47]

Not sure where I am going with this. I saw a vanity license plate the other day that read GR8*68 on a 1968 Chevy. I am not a linguist, but lately I have become interested in Ebonics and leet speak and their effects on the English language. I notice the use of Ebonics more and more in the work place and have recently noticed the emergence of leet speak. With the growing number of computer savvy young people joining the workforce they are bringing their language with them. It reminds me of Orwells "newspeak". At one time I thought Ebonics to be a language used mainly by uneducated poor minorities. There is a simple beauty to the language however. Whereas Ebonics is a culturally driven language I see leet speak as a technologically driven language. By my reasoning wouldn't the use of leet speak identify the user as someone who is educated and computer literate? I see leet speak as a batch file type language, conveying an idea or group of ideas in as little space as possible. I am just wondering if the use of Ebonics and/or leet speak doesn't make a contribution to the English language. The "flappers" of the 20's, the "Beatnics" of the 50's, the "hippies" of the 60's all added to and enriched English, perhaps the "script kiddies" are doing the same at this time. I know that leet speak is shunned on this board, but what are the ideas of some of the members on the validity of leet speak as a language or as a dialect of the English language? Any thoughts?
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[astcell]

My thought is that leet speak is produced from two parents:

1. Abbreviating text such as messaging on a cell phone, and who cares about typos, and

2. Replacing letters and numbers to avoid filters which can stop text transmission, such as using pr0n for porn, etc.

Put these two together 4nd u hv 1337 5p34k!

[Voltage Spike]

Sure, cultural diversity can affect a language. English is constantly evolving, and convenient and useful phrases are often integrated into the vernacular. 31337 speak is somewhat different from normal changes, however, because it applies (almost) exclusively to the written domain.

I will agree that the use of 31337 speak indicates a deep-seated familiarity with technology, but it is also indicative of a poor education and an inability to distinguish between professional and personal environments. (Also note that barrier to using computer systems is so low these days that familiarity with them is not the same as being computer-literate.) To take your comparison to another form of street talk, would an attorney using ebonics in a trial involving a poor, uneducated person help or hinder his case?

Besides, 31337 speak just looks funny.

[astcell]

You can always invent Leetbonics.

[Chris]

You can always invent Leetbonics.

113780n1x d4 80m8 y0!

[Tao_of_pi]

I remember reading about a study that stated leet speak didn't have a terrible effect on the youth, and it actually had some redeemable qualities. I'll try and find a link

[TheCotMan]

wouldn't the use of leet speak identify the user as someone who is educated and computer literate?

Nope. I've seen people who were into skatboarding, but never been into a computer use "sk8r" to mean "skater"

License plates have a limit to how many characters can be used, and people were abbreviating words before leet-speak was as common as it is today. Even conventions for acronyms like "LOL" were common before person computers-- consider SNAFU, and for "leet speak" consider the origins of the word "Jeep" today. ([Probably pronunciation of the letters GP, designation for this vehicle in the manufacturer's parts numbering system : G(overnment) + P, designator for 80-inch wheelbase reconnaissance car.])

I am just wondering if the use of Ebonics and/or leet speak doesn't make a contribution to the English language.

"Contribution" :-) That depends on who you are. Some would call it a degredation of the English language.

It is sometimes argued that leetspeak exists to shorten text and use fewer keystrokes. However, there are times that leetspeak does not decrease the number of keystrokes.

I know that leet speak is shunned on this board, but what are the ideas of some of the members on the validity of leet speak as a language or as a dialect of the English language? Any thoughts?

Language exists to convey ideas, thoughts, emotion and concepts. Does leetspeak help with that?

Wouldn't you say that leetspeak is more of a method to hide information from other? "Security by obscurity"? A system of clique by exclusion? How do kids send text messages that say "sex now?" without parents knowing? or "Let's go smoke." Maybe something as innocent as hiding feelings from parents. (I <3 <initials here> )

The forums are international, and non-english language translation dictionaries don't have so much leetspeak these days. In order to be most effective when using english to pass ideas, thoughts, etc., we accept a common base, and that presently does not include leetspeak.

That last paragraph in leet-speak:
th3 f0rum5 4r3 1nt3rn4t10n4l, 4nd n0n-3ngl15h l4ngu4g3 tr4n5l4t10n d1ct10n4r135 d0n't h4v3 50 much l33t5p34k th353 d4y5. 1n 0rd3r t0 b3 m05t 3ff3ct1v3 wh3n u51ng 3ngl15h t0 p455 1d345, th0ught5, 3tc., w3 4cc3pt 4 c0mm0n b453, 4nd th4t pr353ntly d035 n0t 1nclud3 l33t5p34k.

Which would you rather read?

[bascule]

My favorite license plate of that nature is still "MI2KG4U"

[Voltage Spike]

My favorite license plate of that nature is still "MI2KG4U"

Is that "Am I too cagey for you"?

I've thought about ripping off one of the Defcon attendee's license plates (in my own state, of course): "BRB*AFK". It's just too perfect....

[Xodia]

L33t speak will probably make it into everyday writing between people in the next ten years. Its already happening in high schools everywhere. I used to go a very gossip filled high school and damn near every note a girl wrote was filled with l33t. When you got down to middle school thats nearly all notes were.

I find that amazing because I was in middle school five years ago and not one kid used such talk in their notes. Thats showing how much it changes in a few years. Then again, kids in school are getting progressively more stupid as time goes on. That may explain it.

[rot_link]

An interesting linguistic question.

In my opinion, language has historically be used to enhance the ability to convey thoughts and propositions. 1337 is a highly an esoteric 'language' (I hesitate to even apply that word) that cannot attribute its abstract morphing of words to the desire to express new, or different, thoughts. Rather, it would seem, that the purposeful distortion of words is solely an avenue for rebelling against perceived 'authority' figures, rather than a actual development of language.

What is the purpose of converting the letters in a word to numeric symbols, except to intentionally confuse?

An interesting allegory would be to compare a Internet protocol, like TCP/IP, to our actual spoken languages. The development of a standardized method of communications has enabled networks around the worlds to interact with each other, thereby creating the Internet. Likewise, our spoke languages have evolved into a standardize set of rules (spelling, grammar, etc) which necessarily enables the free flow of ideas.

I think the intentional destruction of a languages (which is what I categorize 1337 as being) can only be the work of an uneducated mind that hasn't been trained to appreciate, nor utilize, this standardized protocol.

[bascule]

Is that "Am I too cagey for you"?

I don't know, am I?

[Second]

My favorite license plate of that nature is still "MI2KG4U"

I wonder if someone would be allowed to use 1337 speak on their plates for an inappropriate word, like phuck, sh1t, or 5h17. That would be interesting.

[AlxRogan]

I wonder if someone would be allowed to use 1337 speak on their plates for an inappropriate word, like phuck, sh1t, or 5h17. That would be interesting.

I can tell you that in the Commonwealth of Virgina, you can go online and "Build Your Own" personalized plate. Several variations I tried using numeric substitution and obscenities were rejected. However I did not try "F4HQ", I've seen that before on a different state, don't remember which one.

[astcell]

My first thought was that the plate said "Am I too gay for you." Hmph.

One thing about the paragraph of leet speak, above. I looked at it and read the entire paragraph as one entry. I saw it and read it all at once. Does that make sense? It is like me describing an African elephant to you or showing you a picture. The picture says it all in one glance. That paragraph was absorbed into my mind in one second, probably because I did not have to read a word and process it, then attach it to the words on either side.

I need help.