How long until keyboards/mice are obsolete?

[bascule]

Saw this story a few days ago:

'Mind over matter' no longer science fiction

It's yet another passive device allowing you to "type" with your brain. That alone is somewhat unremarkable, until you consider how many similar stories we've seen in 2006 alone. Here's a smattering of links to similar stories dealing with active/passive wetware applications to peruse through, if you so desire. All of these are from 2006:

Big Brain Thinking: Stanford neuroscientist Bill Newsome wants to implant an electrode in his brain to better understand human consciousness

Stealth sharks to patrol the high seas

Jesse Sullivan powers robotic arms with his mind

European boffins connect neurons to silicon chips

"Mental typewriter" controlled by thought alone

Now That's Using Your Brain

I think it's becoming clear that brain/computer interfaces are moving from the realm of science fiction into reality.

I'm especially excited by the passive systems which allow you to "type" or control a "mouse pointer". It seems like where voice recognition has failed, passive brain scanning may succeed. These systems map an impulse towards a mechanical action to data appearing within your computer. They require a bit of training, but certainly less than it takes to learn how to use a keyboard.

The best part of these systems is: they can easily be turned into marketable products. There are hundreds of thousands if not millions of people in the world who suffer some debilitating disease, amputation, or spinal injuries which make it impossible for them to type and must resort to more arcane interfaces to computers.

These people will make great early adopters for these devices. Being able to interface with a computer in an equivalent manner (or faster) than everyone else can with a keyboard and mouse will be an enormous boon to their quality of life, and something you can expect a large number of them will be willing to pay for.

Once this starts happening and these devices are turned into a marketable product, commoditization can't be that far off. Presently they look uncomfortable, but we can certainly expect these devices to get smaller and less obtrusive.

When do you think brain/computer interfaces will replace the keyboard and mouse?

[theprez98]

When do you think brain/computer interfaces will replace the keyboard and mouse?

My guess, when they are economically feasible, and they work as good or better than a keyboard and mouse... I think we're still a ways off.

[TheCotMan]

My guess, when they are economically feasible, and they work as good or better than a keyboard and mouse... I think we're still a ways off.

I agree with your idea, but I think they will have to be about 10 times better before they really are able to replace and take over the keyboards and mice. (Look at how IOMega drives were 100MB and staged to take over for 3.5" floppy/stiffy disks as the "A:" drive, but didn't quite do it.)

Even then, if this is direct brainwave controll of computer input, then we have a whole new area of computer security to consider-- remote snarfing passphrases, and data sent to the computer.

Then there is worry of leakage of data sent to the computer-- especially if the speed is fast enough to work as fast as we think.
"I should send an e-mail to my boss and tell them what I think! ... Whoops. Did I really send that?" (heh -heh)

[Voltage Spike]

Such interfaces are clearly a long, long way off. Reading through a couple of the posted articles makes it quite obvious that we aren't approaching the bionic age.

'Mind over matter' seems to be about a binary decision machine. The user, through concentration, can indicate an interest in a highlighted option. In essence, it sounds as if increased brain activity is the only control (of course, it doesn't require surgery).

The story of Jesse Sullivan is about a set of sensors that detect movement of the pectoral muscles and translates them into an alternate set of movements for robotic arms. The primary point of interest here is that the human brain was able to adapt to work around our primitive technology.

That's not to say the research isn't useful, but we are still at a stage where we are flailing our arms let alone learning to crawl. I don't doubt that we'll get there someday, but I've been reading stories of electronic cameras wired into the optic nerve for over a decade now ... and the technology hasn't improved as much as I'd hoped.

Personally, I think the biggest hurdle is getting around human experimentation in most countries (especially when significant surgery is involved). It's not that I disagree with the polices, but it would be like writing drivers for an undocumented piece of hardware with the stipulation that you get it 100% correct on the first try. It can be done, but it sure ain't easy.

[GBHis]

Such interfaces are clearly a long, long way off. Reading through a couple of the posted articles makes it quite obvious that we aren't approaching the bionic age.

Agreed. I haven't read all of them, (I'm in a hurry. I'll make it short.) but the one about the sharks... Guess it's working via radio controlled "buzzers", that manipulates with the nerves? And some camera?

I believe that we can make "computer enhanced body parts" in some near future. 2010? (read like Luke Skywalkers "fake hand", not regular CYBORGS).

Manipulating the brain with electric impulses might be possible - and dangerous - and *guess again* will not be a part of our world (out of the testlabs) before ... min 2015?

But "reading information" from the brain (read ESP, roleplayers) sounds ... sci-fi. It would require either radio signals (?damaging the brain?) or wires/sensors put all over your brain. I wouldn't have one in MY head... [wires=example due to my english. O'course we will not have wires.]

Killing the mouse
Maybe it is be possible to "read" where the eyes where focused?
The keyboard will still be hard to replace... You would also need to have a "pause" button, so that you could look away (from screen) a sec or to... I like my trackball.

[bascule]

I think a lot of you are ignoring the potential of passive, completely external systems. The first one I linked was an example of this, as was the "mental typewriter" article.

I think the mouse will be the first to go. There's a big context switching penalty when you have to move a hand from the keyboard to manipulate the mouse, and this has lead many to try to operate as much from the keyboard, even when it's sub-optimal (because it still saves time over switching from the mouse and back)

Controlling the movement of a mouse pointer is a lot simpler task than attempting to read in enough information from an EEG to figure out what a user is trying to type. If that technology ever became popular, then you have a foot in the door for a keyboard replacement too, especially considering that you can likely replace the keyboard in such a situation with a mere software upgrade, rather than requiring new hardware.

I really don't think it will be too long before we're moving mouse pointers around the screen with our brains rather than a clunky, mechanical mouse. And if you can get the gaming community interested, that's a huge market already.

So, screw all your pessamism, it's happening sooner than later

[Voltage Spike]

I think a lot of you are ignoring the potential of passive, completely external systems.

I'm not ignoring the potential, but I suppose I am a pessimist. This technology is not easy and we are not even close to making it a reality. What is going to change in the near future that brings the technology closer?

As for GBHis' "eye mouse", that invention is a reality ... at least in labs. Our local university has a monitor that detects where you are looking with a fairly high level of accuracy (we use it for psychology experiments). Unfortunately, it requires calibration and your head being in the correct position, but it does work.

Maybe we should ask why touch screens never really took off. They are more intuitive and faster to operate than mice and yet, apart from the occasional library, touch-screen monitors are a rarity.

[foxyboy]

If this technology did become a reality I wonder how long it would take before someone came up with the first brain virus or hack?

There are other conecpts to consider such as governments being able to get direct access into your brain.

Thankfully its going to be a long time before this technology does happen.(assuming it does at all!)

[TheCotMan]

If this technology did become a reality I wonder how long it would take before someone came up with the first brain virus or hack?

This would require the use of a brain input device, which is at least one more order of magnitude greater in complexity than receiving brainwaves externally. (Receiving does not mean understanding, and we can choose to interpret brainwave patterns as output signals different from the actual thought: feelings of lust? double-click., anger? single-click... well, you get the idea.)

There are examples of "brain viruses" (really, more like "mind" viruses) right now. A simple example is the con known as the pyramid scheme. Once one person is infected, and believes it will work, they will try to sell their friends on the same idea. They may even show evidence of "profits" when encouraging others. Some will fall prey to the idea, and may make money, but most of the people (~the last half of people involved) are the ones that lose the most. (It still happens today)

( I am sure Bascule will make some comment about memes being like this, as ideas, concepts or themes are wrapped around some popular unit, which is passed around for people to share. ]:> )

Another example might be, "brainwashing," though such a system is difficult to propagate forward from those brainwashed to brainwash new people. Cults have had success in this as have <deleted> groups. (<deleted> because it is one of the big no-no topics on the forums.)

Drug abuse, child abuse, and other domestic abuse can be examples of this, as the experience is observed, learned and passed to future generations, or peers. (Though genetic predisposition to addiction or violence can play a role in how effective these can infect new targets.)

What this technology (write to brains) may do, is to help bypass "bullshit" filters that people have created through experience, or education. It may also expose some mutation and advantage as a "new" trait that may exist, but not be known, or may come to exist, that could help people have a filter even if they are equipped with such brain I/O devices.

There are other conecpts to consider such as governments being able to get direct access into your brain.

I'm going to skip my answer to this as it would be too political.

Thankfully its going to be a long time before this technology does happen.(assuming it does at all!)

Bascule is a fan of singulartiy, and tends to believe that we could be there very quickly. He and I have had discusions about this.

[bascule]

I am sure Bascule will make some comment about memes being like this, as ideas, concepts or themes are wrapped around some popular unit, which is passed around for people to share. ]:>

Yay! I'd classify things like pyramid schemes, urban legends, chain letters, and <deleted> as "pathological memes", i.e. something which offers no value or harms the individual who passes it along.

Bascule is a fan of singulartiy, and tends to believe that we could be there very quickly. He and I have had discusions about this.

Yep. I believe that the rate of technological progress is accelerating. This is my answer to what has made the past year different from any other. The resolution with which we can scan the brain is increasing exponentially. Furthermore, computational power is increasing, and with it, we can use more complex classification/Bayesian algorithms for processing data from the brain.

The main point is that all of this technology is additive. The results of all of the research projects I linked will be used by those developing the next generation of research projects, and so on. Projects like CCortex are giving us deeper and deeper insights into the way the brain functions.

That's how it always works. Something seems like science fiction until it's upon us, then everything changes. It happened with the Internet: it lurked in the background for decades, a tool used only by nerds, then it hit the knee-of-the-curve and exploded. We're going to see the same thing with brain/computer interfaces. The only thing we can really debate is when we'll hit that knee-of-the-curve.

[GBHis]

There are other conecpts to consider such as governments being able to get direct access into your brain.

Yeah... PGP!
Dang, you'll need to store the keyring somewhere. It looked as a nice idea, though

-GBHis

[jur1st]

I can see it now:

Gentlemen:

the meeting originally scheduled for boobies tuesday has been moved to thursday, and will be held at the brooksider damn that waitress is hot where we will discuss the following important topics:

clearly there will need to be filters for drifting minds..

[TheCotMan]

clearly there will need to be filters for drifting minds..

Something like this could bring an end to the human race, if the sexes of the heterosexual population each could read the others minds. However, it might be possible that intermediate markets of sperm/egg banks would flourish instead.

Another reason? Who will want to read the mind of that crazy hobo that rants about tree testicles being shoved inside tiny burros.

[Nikita]

Another reason? Who will want to read the mind of that crazy hobo that rants about tree testicles being shoved inside tiny burros.

I have not laughed like that in a long time.

[zoasterboy]

nope

I think somthing we also have to think about is if people would be accepting of the idea of getting some computer part installed in their heads. Some people would go for it, but the majority would not. Also, this would cost alot, and you couldnt just go to the local computer store to get one. You would need a brain surgon.