Recently Arrested.

[astcell]

Re: Recently Arrested.

So, laws against theft of service are not enough to stop you from using it?

The punishment isn't motivation enough to stop, like speeding.

[BonzoESC]

Re: Recently Arrested.

Well, the punishment is motiviation enough (if it comes down to a night in the drunk tank and having shit probably get confiscated by the police, I'll just wait until I find a coffee shop), but the enforcement leaves much to be desired. The two cases that have been cited in this thread have all been people huddled over their laptop in a parked car when it's dark out. Maybe people will stop once more cases come up when the criminal's a bit more clever/thoughtful, but the law's even less effectual than WEP at preventing breakins.

[astcell]

Re: Recently Arrested.

Sitting in a dark car with a laptop... why not just wear a black mast, a black and white striped shirt and carry a money bag with a dollar sign on the side?

[Voltage Spike]

Re: Recently Arrested.

Let me tell you this : You are wrong. Let me repeat it : You are wrong.

Okay, you guys seem to be arguing different things. One party is expressing what they think the law should be, and the other party is explaining what the law is (and also implicitly assumes that because it is the law it is right).

If nothing stops you from using it, it is still NOT legal to do so, unless you have explicit permission to do so.

You have to admit that is rather extreme, though. Whom do I ask for explicit permission to access a web site? How do I punish all the commercial entities who fill my (physical) mailbox with junk mail? If I broadcast my SSID as "Free For All", meaning free as in freedom, are police still allowed to prosecute those that connect?

I like Deviant Ollam's comparison to water because it reflects one of the core issues that few ever discuss: the cost of freeloaders is so low that most feel it shouldn't be punished. Few people, especially in the United States, pay per byte of data. The cost is sunk, and other people are not going to influence that. Even if they were to pay per-byte, the amount of data involved in a quick web access is of little consequence.

Like many things, people should take intent into account. Were they accessing your network because they were lost and wanted to find directions? Or were they trying to commit a crime (e.g., copyright violation) and didn't want to use their own resources to do so? To go back to an earlier comparison, if you left your garage door open when you left the house, should I be arrested for stepping onto your property to close the door? (Note that I said should and not, as I expect most of the answers to be, could.)

[Deviant Ollam]

Re: Recently Arrested.

if you left your garage door open when you left the house, should I be arrested for stepping onto your property to close the door? (Note that I said should and not, as I expect most of the answers to be, could.)

now this is an interesting question that used to get tossed around a lot more than it is nowadays... the so called "ethical cracking" or "good samaritan cracking"

example: someone's mail server is running WinNT 3.5 an MS Exchange 1.0. the computer gets owned by some attacking bot machine in korea and starts attempting to spread a worm to many other computers, including one of mine. i notice the attack, trace to the source IP, and recognize/identify which security hole is the problem.

am i justified in this situation (morally/legally/etc) in breaking into that remote system (either with the presently-exploited hole or via another) in order to clean up the other person's mess? do i leave a message or note?

personally, i've never been comfortable with achieving "illicit" entry somewhere (either digitally or physically) in order to contain an insecure situation. i wouldn't walk all the way up someone's driveway in order to close their garage door and i wouldn't access a remote server to do some other admin's job for them.

however... sniffing around, inspecting things from a distance, and ascertaining as much information as possible in order to convey this in a message to the irresponsible/ignorant/confused party is something that i do not have any moral qualms with. anything that i can do passively which helps me to identify either the problem or an individual to whom i should speak is fine in my book.

leave a note in the homeowner's mailbox (maybe even going so far as to say "i notice you have what appears to be an older model LiftMaster which has a tendency to bounce the door back up if it hits the pavement too hard on the way down... adjust the bottom stop knob to prevent this") or email anyone whom you can identify at a company... but do not do the "fixing" work yourself tends to be my guideline.

[Nikita]

Re: Recently Arrested.

http://www.vnunet.com/computing/news...denial-service
From the article:
"Cyber criminals launching denial-of-service (Dos) attacks now face up to 10 years in prison, following the Police and Justice Act’s (PJA) passage into law last week.

The new rules also prohibit the supply of tools that can be used for hacking, with penalties of up to two years."

Also: http://j4b.mittelstandswiki.de/hacke...usly-punished/

changes to the Police and Justice bill would make it an offense to make, adapt, supply, or offer to supply any article which is designed or adapted to impair the operation of a computer, prevent or hinder access to a computer, or impair the operation of any program or access to any data.


On another note This is quickly turning into its own popular thread.

leave a note in the homeowner's mailbox (maybe even going so far as to say "i notice you have what appears to be an older model LiftMaster which has a tendency to bounce the door back up if it hits the pavement too hard on the way down... adjust the bottom stop knob to prevent this") or email anyone whom you can identify at a company... but do not do the "fixing" work yourself tends to be my guideline.

I would be inclined to agree with you, however.... I used to be a manager at an auto glass shop, not only did i handle the network, telemarketing systems, databases, some other nifty little things i don't know how i managed to make but i did, I also handled all the people who were pissed about one thing or another. When I say ALL the people, I mean it. Anyone who had a complaint to us i dealt with. Well our thoughtful installation guys took it upon themselves to put our cards or our coupon on the windshield of cars that needed a rock chip fix that could cause a bad crack, or if they had a windshield that would get them a ticket if they were pulled over or stopped by the wrong cop. Mainly just our info and a pleasant note saying something like "I can prob, get your windshield replaced for under 100$" Well, Unfortunately there are a lot of people who don't like it when we point out the obvious, and even more people who want something for free. There were a few phone calls I got where we were accused of causing the chip, crack or busted glass. Not true but imagine if they were telling the truth when they said, " I never saw that hole before and it was just fine until you came around, or a week after i got your note that little hole became a huge crack, you must have done something?!." etc etc.. now you have to deal with that liability. You are a stranger who placed yourself at the crime scene and admitted you were there in the room with the murder weapon. Regardless if you are the person who called 911, you are still an automatic suspect. The only time I may do something is in rare situations, life or death or the occasional empathetic reaction to someone else's imminent misery. And as far as closing the garage door, who is to say they didn't leave it open for the utility guy or a family member who forgot their keys?

[Voltage Spike]

Re: Recently Arrested.

Wow. Real life tends to make people really jaded, doesn't it? At some point the well-intentioned are always punished, but what vast majority of the time when you aren't? Is it really worth not improving the world out of a feeling of self-defense?

our thoughtful installation guys took it upon themselves to put our cards or our coupon on the windshield

Well perhaps people shouldn't go advertising and attempting to profit from their good deeds. The intention was good, but that little attached statement saying the notifying party has a commercial interest in me is certainly not going to give me warm feelings.

And as far as closing the garage door, who is to say they didn't leave it open for the utility guy or a family member who forgot their keys?

Which is always a possibility, but most people aren't that stupid. Why would you put a big sign on the front of your house saying "The doors are unlocked!" when you could just, you know, unlock a front or back door.

[liberator]

FBI taps Mafia cell phone mic as eavesdropping tool

The story does not mention any arrests, but it sure makes for interesting reading.

Also no mention of remotely activating the phone's camera, but in principle that should be doable, at least to take periodic stills and send them back to HQ.

What an interesting project to take on! A cell phone as an audio visual surveliance tool with realtime geolocation. Presumably the FBI has working code, which means that the GNU version can't be far behind.

I can just see the feature creep now: It only starts listening in continuous mode when in a certain location, or when a periodic sample of audio sent back to HQ is flagged as being the target's voice. Or at least, that's what they tell the judge and the press.

Some excerpts:

"The FBI appears to have begun using a novel form of electronic surveillance in criminal investigations: remotely activating a mobile phone's microphone and using it to eavesdrop on nearby conversations."

....

"Kaplan's opinion said that the eavesdropping technique "functioned whether the phone was powered on or off." Some handsets can't be fully powered down without removing the battery; for instance, some Nokia models will wake up when turned off if an alarm is set."

....

Nextel and Samsung handsets and the Motorola Razr are especially vulnerable to software downloads that activate their microphones, said James Atkinson, a counter-surveillance consultant who has worked closely with government agencies. "They can be remotely accessed and made to transmit room audio all the time," he said. "You can do that without having physical access to the phone."

[BonzoESC]

Re: FBI taps Mafia cell phone mic as eavesdropping tool

Also no mention of remotely activating the phone's camera, but in principle that should be doable, at least to take periodic stills and send them back to HQ.

Makes me glad that most recent Sony-Ericsson models have physical lens covers, that's for sure.

[liberator]

Re: FBI taps Mafia cell phone mic as eavesdropping tool

Makes me glad that most recent Sony-Ericsson models have physical lens covers, that's for sure.

I guess we all need to start using opaque cell phone condoms Of course, we need a new version that is soundproof as well.

[Rance]

Re: Recently Arrested.

make them "water dirt mud paint sweat blood snow proof."

Because that's what all serial killers need. I mean I sure hate it when I get blood all over my celephone, it makes me cut them even harder.

[Nikita]

Re: Recently Arrested.

An update on the NASA Hacker dude.

And this article (?) is funny, doesn't matter if they meant it as a joke or not, I took it that way. Btw, read the enclosed link too.

[octalpus]

Re: Recently Arrested.

Also: http://j4b.mittelstandswiki.de/hacke...usly-punished/

changes to the Police and Justice bill would make it an offense to make, adapt, supply, or offer to supply any article which is designed or adapted to impair the operation of a computer, prevent or hinder access to a computer, or impair the operation of any program or access to any data.

Watch out, Cisco... those PIX's are about to become contraband!

Seriously, who writes this stuff?

[Nikita]

Re: Recently Arrested.

http://intelliscan.typepad.com/pegas...e_hacker_.html

Chinese hacker arrested for theft of 2.2 billion in virtual gold.
Geeeesh.

"Logic bomb" backfires on hacker

[patsprou]

Re: Recently Arrested.

http://www.cybercrime.gov/cccases.html
Here's a decent list of recently arrested computer criminals.