Post DEFCON 17: thoughts, ideas, suggestions -- make Defcon 18 better!

[Rhenium]

Re: Post DEFCON 17: thoughts, ideas, suggestions -- make Defcon 18 better!

Were you the guy from Melbourne up at Queercon?

I attended DefCon for the first time travelling all the way from Australia and have to in general say that I was fabulously impressed. Also, I was given a free ride in the sense that I didn't have enough money from my vacation to really attend the proper con but was given everything secondhand from all of you wonderful people in the suites and hotel who were willing to chat with me. I did contribute by helping the goons in anyway possible and would like to be a GPA (GOON PERSONAL ASSISTANT) again next year :)

What I was shocked, disgusted, and HIGHLY disturbed by was the unwillingness of any of my vendors who I work with in OZ making any effort to engage the Security community at this conference. For my part, I intend to send out several proposals for NON-INTRUSIVE ways my executive friends could engage this conference. I will be speaking to both Cisco & Commvault (not about anything I learned obviously) and letting them know how some of their competitors made them look like complete tools.

Any ideas would be appreciated. I will definitely be back next year with the funds to attend the full conference, just hanging around and squatting had me HIGHLY intrigued.

cheers,
poofta.

[Schuyler]

Re: Post DEFCON 17: thoughts, ideas, suggestions -- make Defcon 18 better!

Someone mentioned that people might have been sneaking into Skyboxes, as you weren't checked for badges there. It was actually a bigger problem as there were people sharing badges. I can understand this if you are here for a day of con & a friend wants to catch the end or whatever, but there were people actively swapping with each other between skybox & talks so they could see all of con on a split badge. I don't think it was more than a couple of people, but of course has the potential to become a regular phenomenon.

Solution is obvious, stage a staff member by the stairs.

[meethade]

Re: Post DEFCON 17: thoughts, ideas, suggestions -- make Defcon 18 better!

So, I was wondering if adding a preregistration option would help with predicting and handling the size of the crowd. I know it says in the FAQ that registration is cash only and only at the time of the event, but with so many people, being able to count how many have registered could be useful with planning.

I don't mean to say that the cash only option should be replaced, just to suggest preregistration via credit card or PayPal as an additional option to what already exists.

Anyways, I would not mind paying a little more if that meant the crowding issue could be handled better. Not that I want to pay more, but if that's what it takes, then I'm OK with that, as long as it is a nominal increase.

I did notice that the crowding got better towards the end, but I can't really say that it was due to better organization, although I'm sure that helped.

I still had a great time though.

[Abby_Normal]

Re: Post DEFCON 17: thoughts, ideas, suggestions -- make Defcon 18 better!

So, I was wondering if adding a preregistration option would help with predicting and handling the size of the crowd. .

I would be in favor of preregistering, esp if it meant I'd actually get a badge. I've been coming to DC for years, and this is the first year I didn't a badge.

I don't give a rats ass who knows I'm attending defcon, anonymity isn't an issue for me.

[Rosemaker]

Re: Post DEFCON 17: thoughts, ideas, suggestions -- make Defcon 18 better!

So, I was wondering if adding a preregistration option would help with predicting and handling the size of the crowd. I know it says in the FAQ that registration is cash only and only at the time of the event, but with so many people, being able to count how many have registered could be useful with planning.

I don't mean to say that the cash only option should be replaced, just to suggest preregistration via credit card or PayPal as an additional option to what already exists.

Pre-registration opens up a can of worms, and can quickly destroy anonymity.

Assume there are "f" badges.

People who surrender their Electronic Data will get a badge. Now there are "f-ED" badges.

As f-ED approaches f, you will not get a badge unless you work somewhere you're willing to be known, or are in the first part of the cash line.

One solution to this is to have only a set number of pre-registration badges (30% maybe) that will be available before the event. I disagree with this because it cuts into *my* advantage, which is being able to tell work that I have to leave Wednesday so I can be there early Thursday to get my badge.

XD

[netstat]

Re: Post DEFCON 17: thoughts, ideas, suggestions -- make Defcon 18 better!

I disagree with this because it cuts into *my* advantage, which is being able to tell work that I have to leave Wednesday so I can be there early Thursday to get my badge.

I am so using that line next year :)

[Voltage Spike]

Re: Post DEFCON 17: thoughts, ideas, suggestions -- make Defcon 18 better!

I don't mean to say that the cash only option should be replaced, just to suggest preregistration via credit card or PayPal as an additional option to what already exists.

The first problem is that pre-registration will signifcantly slow down the registration processing. I know people want their badges, but I don't want to see it happen at the expense of longer lines and more waiting in line at all times.

Personally, I'd be more inclined to spend extra $20 to see the badges not made in China. Okay 300% is a lot for the U.S. but someone in the community may be able to bring it down through their connections and there is always Mexico.

There are some small things that can be done with the walls to increase hallway accessibility. You know what appeared to help the most with movement? Someone printing a sign for the hallway door reading "Stay right ->". The problem is simple and, as we have seen, difficult to solve: people need to stop being so self-centered and realize that walking slowly or stopping with a group of five to talk is incredibly selfish. I would suggest that attendees stop being so sheepish and tell strangers to move when they are being jerks. Most people are inclined to do the right thing, but they need a reminder that what they are doing is wrong.

[evel aka matt]

Re: Post DEFCON 17: thoughts, ideas, suggestions -- make Defcon 18 better!

The first problem is that pre-registration will signifcantly slow down the registration processing. I know people want their badges, but I don't want to see it happen at the expense of longer lines and more waiting in line at all times.

Pre-reg won't slow anything down if the only option is to have the badge mailed.

[Voltage Spike]

Re: Post DEFCON 17: thoughts, ideas, suggestions -- make Defcon 18 better!

Pre-reg won't slow anything down if the only option is to have the badge mailed.

That would be nice except that the organizers are actively against revealing badge information ahead of time. You could then say, "mail a placeholder for exchange", but I wouldn't trust people not to duplicate the item and have driven costs marginally higher.

[big chopper]

Re: Post DEFCON 17: thoughts, ideas, suggestions -- make Defcon 18 better!

Another amazing DEFCON. A few thoughts...

I DO NOT believe that DEFCON has outgrown The Riviera. I think that 80% of the problems related to congestion could be solved by providing a simpler badge. The badge--though cool, has taken on a life of its own that is interfering with DEFCON. DEFCON is not BADGECON, though one could get confused,

I pity the speakers who had early talks and the people who wanted to attend them because a good half of the con was waiting in line for some type of badge procurement related activity early on.

PLEASE. LET"S NOT LET THE BADGE CONTROL THE SHOW.

I miss the simple metal stamped badges we had ten years ago. Let's get back to basics.
--BC,

[zCat]

Re: Post DEFCON 17: thoughts, ideas, suggestions -- make Defcon 18 better!

My first DEFCON was DC14, so that's my baseline reference.

We had several "regulars" in my group who couldn't make it this year due to work, and one new person who bailed, also related to work. I brought one new person, but we lost three. I don't know where all the other new people came from.

Personal impressions:

With the addition of the turbo room and the skybox there were a lot more talks, but it was harder to find out what was going on at a given time since they weren't on the visual schedule grid. I liked the DEFCON 101 talks, but didn't like having so many in parallel. For some strange reason, most of the talks I really wanted to go to were on Sunday...

Thoughts:

I wouldn't mind volunteering for a shift keeping the hallways moving if it meant that I could get to the talks I wanted to on time. (If I can help you get to your talk on time on my shift, maybe someone can do the same for me later.)

Having badges arrive early makes all the difference. The lines last year and this year to exchange badges contributed to the crowding issue in the hallways. I'd try that before hiking up the prices in an effort to dissuade people from coming.

[Dallas]

Re: Post DEFCON 17: thoughts, ideas, suggestions -- make Defcon 18 better!

As Long as DT remembers Christmas we are ok, however they may still run out of badges as they will not know how many will attend. I think, that they should have a (I have correct change line) and a (Im a dumbass) line, and train the people handing out badges how to trade money in less than 10 sec (Im talking about the Riv people). Then maybe setup 2 lines and run them through. If you are in the Dumbass line, you get ran into circles.

Just a thought.

OR!! Use a rolling badge system of say 1000 badges at $ 200 each which can be pre-ordered and picked up (maybe donate some to the EFF)..then have the rest wait in the Correct change and Dumbass line.

I get there on Wed and have never had an issue.

[notmjp]

Re: Post DEFCON 17: thoughts, ideas, suggestions -- make Defcon 18 better!

Why not the best of both worlds? As I understand it, the problem with badges is that more people came than there were badges.

Why not, instead of a pre-registration system that the FBI will ask DT for at some point, there is a simple online poll of "I am definitively going to DefCon this year." with people who are going clicking that. Not giving out real name or dox or whatever, but just getting a baseline for how many people to expect that year?

[pwrdwnsys]

Re: Post DEFCON 17: thoughts, ideas, suggestions -- make Defcon 18 better!

On the discussion re: price of badges, I felt that I got as much {educational, knowledge} value from DefCon as I did from BlackHat. Whilst I'm not saying that DefCon should be $1400 (or whatever BHUSA09 Briefings cost my company this year), I would quite gladly pay more for DefCon. IMHO, the Riv is shit and whilst I salute the goons for trying to keep order, Friday was just a joke and I gave up queuing mid-afternoon and went for beer instead.

Thanks for DT and everyone else involved in organising DC - great event, and I'll definitely be back for more next year.

[Club81]

Re: Post DEFCON 17: thoughts, ideas, suggestions -- make Defcon 18 better!

...I would quite gladly pay more for DefCon......IMHO, the Riv is shit and whilst I salute the goons for trying to keep order, Friday was just a joke and I gave up queuing mid-afternoon and went for beer instead.

This, unfortunately, was my exact reaction, too. Grab a couple cold ones and attend a session that I could actually make it to.

Yes, I learned a lot in those sessions. Yes, they were good. Yes, it was valuable. Yes, I was missing the actual sessions that I wanted to see.