Calling All Female Hackers

[Deviant Ollam]

Re: Calling All Female Hackers

a hard time with the whole smart/sexy balance thing when it comes to being a girl in the hacker scene. I mean, the unspoken rule seems to be that you are allowed to be sexy, but goodness not TOO sexy or else you will ruin everyone's illusions of what a 'good' girl you are.

well, we all find you to be smart... and there's no doubt that you're adorable as well.

personally, i've never had a problem with anyone whose needle pegs the meter on both the "smart" and "sexy" side of things. this past weekend at HAR i had the pleasure of meeting someone who is as gorgeous as a model, and whose mind is even hotter by about a factor of four.

not a thing wrong with that in my book, i must say. save for the way it made everyone else in the Lockpick Village tent a bit less able to concentrate whenever she stopped by.

i'm of the opinion that people who react in a negative or unsupportive way to women in the scene who are "too pretty" or "too bright" are simply showing off their own insecurities.

[violet]

Re: Calling All Female Hackers

I really don't understand why some of the girls where dressed the way they were, I mean you don't have to look like a tramp to look good ladies.

seriously.

Eh, just enjoy it for what it is. Some girls feel that in order to BE sexy, that they have to look trampy. It's sad, when girls will go so far outside their comfort zone in dress and habit to make themselves feel sexy, when it's really just about their self-esteem.

But then, and I'll stand up and admit it, there's girls like me who LIKE dressing on the "slutty" or "trampy" side. It's been my style for years - super short skirts, sky-high heels, fishnets and garter belts, low-cut tops ... it's just what I like. It's not a self-esteem problem where I'm trying to be sexy, I just think it's cute. I'm also an absolutely shameless attention whore - I love attention, whether at DEFCON, at line in the bank, at work, or at home.

So basically dude (chick?), just shrug your shoulders, enjoy the eye candy, and stop worrying about WHY they're dressed like that. Unless they REALLY shouldn't be. Not trying to be a bitch, but short skirts and thongs have a weight limit, ladies.

On a side note, is it just me or does anyone else have a hard time with the whole smart/sexy balance thing when it comes to being a girl in the hacker scene. I mean, the unspoken rule seems to be that you are allowed to be sexy, but goodness not TOO sexy or else you will ruin everyone's illusions of what a 'good' girl you are.

I have a HUGE problem with it. lol Like I stated above, I'm downright slutty sometimes with the way I dress. I don't REALIZE when I'm getting dressed in the morning what I look like - I don't shop specifically to look like a slut. I just pick what I like and go from there. I have a lot of trouble too because I don't just work in IT/Networking ... I'm a stripper. Yes, seriously.

Being overtly sexy comes naturally to me, and when people find out that I'm a stripper, they FLIP. Either I'm the hacker goddess because I could kill your system wearing nothing but my glasses and 6 inch heels; or I MUST be lying about my skills and day-job because 'all stripperz r dum'. I just gave up. Girls glare at me for looking too sexy and catching their boyfriend's attention, guys will oggle at me for my ass and not my brain, some respect me for the intelligent slut I am, and everything inbetween. Easier just to not worry about it.

Call me a scene-whore or attention whore or whatever. Fuck it. lol

[bascule]

Re: Calling All Female Hackers

If you people seriously think there aren't enough women at Defcon you've obviously never been to a programming convention. They literally plastered over the "Women" sign on the women's bathroom with a handwritten men sign. No reason not to be pragmatic, I guess, but a definite admission that you are failing to address a female audience, if it exists.

[Rhenium]

Re: Calling All Female Hackers

Hmmm... I wonder if it might be a confidence thing?

Maybe next year I'll sexify it up a bit, but I have my doctorate and I don't need to prove myself, so capri's and a standard black t-shirt is fine. I think generally the correlation coefficient between a girl's brain and her dress is weak to say the least, probably around zero at Defcon.

[Rhenium]

Re: Calling All Female Hackers

Hmmm... stand back everyone, this calls for STATISTICS!

[Ne0nRa1n]

Re: Calling All Female Hackers

So basically dude (chick?), just shrug your shoulders, enjoy the eye candy, and stop worrying about WHY they're dressed like that. Unless they REALLY shouldn't be. Not trying to be a bitch, but short skirts and thongs have a weight limit, ladies.

Why should 'being sexy' only be something for the thin and the young? I say rock whatever you got if it is what makes you feel good.

some respect me for the intelligent slut I am...

I love that quote! 'Intelligent slut'. You are totally my new hero(ine) now. *grins*

[Ne0nRa1n]

Re: Calling All Female Hackers

On another side tangent since we are talking about 'girl stuff'' anyway, am I the only girl here that wishes that 'Hacker Jeopardy' would die a horrible and painful death? I know at least a couple of women that refuse to attend DEFCON just because the event exists.

And if we aren't going to put it out of its misery, can't we at least have a gay, transexual or even just a man 'Vinyl Vanna' for a change?

[shrdlu]

Re: Calling All Female Hackers

On another side tangent since we are talking about 'girl stuff'' anyway, am I the only girl here that wishes that 'Hacker Jeopardy' would die a horrible and painful death? I know at least a couple of women that refuse to attend DEFCON just because the event exists.

I doubt that's the only reason, but HJ certainly discourages female participation.

And if we aren't going to put it out of its misery, can't we at least have a gay, transexual or even just a man 'Vinyl Vanna' for a change?

Oh my god. This is the best suggestion EVER. I vote for gay. The discomfort quotient for most of the guys on the stage would be huge, and provide hours and hours of fun for the audience. It would be excellent for any women on the teams also, for any number of reasons.

[tequilastrapple]

Re: Calling All Female Hackers

And if we aren't going to put it out of its misery, can't we at least have a gay, transexual or even just a man 'Vinyl Vanna' for a change?

Zapphire suggested something like that five years ago, the year when Hacker Jeopardy was briefly replaced by "The Leetest Link." She suggested we also have a "Sammy Suede" for "sexquanimity." Nothing came of it, but I thought it was a great idea. You can find the discussion about it in the Defcon 12 Wrap-up.

[xor]

Re: Calling All Female Hackers

You have a really great point there. I have had a few really bad objectification/dehumanization incidents at DEFCON, and one of those literally brought me to tears - but for the amount of time I have been going, those are really good odds.

On a side note, is it just me or does anyone else have a hard time with the whole smart/sexy balance thing when it comes to being a girl in the hacker scene. I mean, the unspoken rule seems to be that you are allowed to be sexy, but goodness not TOO sexy or else you will ruin everyone's illusions of what a 'good' girl you are.

All I've got to say is I'm sooo jealous. If I was only 20 years younger :-). Where were all you wonderful, smart, beautiful women when I was in engineering school.


xor

Ps Don't kid yourselves, intelligent, is the new sexy.

[Voltage Spike]

Re: Calling All Female Hackers

She suggested we also have a "Sammy Suede" for "sexquanimity."

I was thinking more "Manna Vinyl". Just swap the eye candy out when there would normally be an outfit change. It would be interesting to see what happens when much of the audience wants the team to miss the Double Jeopardy question.

At the end of the day, the contest would just as fun if it was the exact same thing with no stripping. I think you need someone else on stage to rile up the crowd (even though Wynn does an excellent job), though.

Or I coudl go back and read the previous discussion where I may have said the exact same thing...

[violet]

Re: Calling All Female Hackers

Why should 'being sexy' only be something for the thin and the young? I say rock whatever you got if it is what makes you feel good.

I don't mean that sexy should ONLY be for the thin and young - not by a long shot! Hell, working at a local strip club here in town, I danced with a woman who was in her late 50's! And yeah, you could tell she was older - but the woman was in AMAZING shape and was a very confident girl. And big girls can be sexy as hell too. One of my bridesmaids at my upcoming wedding is in the 400lb range, and she's sexy and beautiful.

There does come a point at which you leave certain TYPES of sexy to certain TYPES of people. What looks sexy and slutty on me, won't necessarily look that way on someone else. There's a definite art to slut-fashion.

I love that quote! 'Intelligent slut'. You are totally my new hero(ine) now. *grins*

Aww, thank you! Fuck 'slut' being an insult. I'm pulling a Randal a la Clerks 2 and taking that shit back! <3

[barry99705]

Re: Calling All Female Hackers

All I've got to say is I'm sooo jealous. If I was only 20 years younger :-). Where were all you wonderful, smart, beautiful women when I was in engineering school.


xor

Ps Don't kid yourselves, intelligent, is the new sexy.

Were they even allowed to vote then??



Hey, Thorn wasn't there, so anybody older than me is fair game!

[BlackOrchid]

Re: Calling All Female Hackers

Defcon is reflection of society in general when it comes to perception and treatment of women.

Go buy a computer with spouse: Salesman will address the man. My husband has NO interest in muscle cars, computers, weapons, rock climbing, camping or flying ... I do, but the sales people will address him.

I've been groped more OUTSIDE defcon than AT.

As for how a woman dresses-It doesn't matter. I get treated pretty much the same regardless of whether I dressed as a 'scene-whore' as opposed to my normal mode of no make up, hair in a pony tail being a bum.

And I'll say it again-we really need to give credit to women who dress 'scenewhorish!' I did it ONE night and damn, it takes a lot of time and effort! LOL. (In fact, I had to borrow a tshirt from a friend about 4 hours later!)

Women tend to be harsh judges of other women but I'm pretty lucky that the female friends I've made at defcon are VERY secure strong women who do not feel the need to trash-talk. If you want to be perceived and treated with respect, then respect and accept other people for who they are. It's a very simple concept.

OK-stepping off the soapbox. Who's next?

[mfreeck]

Re: Calling All Female Hackers

Overall, my experiences as a female at Defcon have been positive. I agree that there have gotten to be more females as the years roll on. My first Defcon (X) I was deathly afraid of dressing at all girly and being mistaken for a scene whore. I think over the years the lines have begun to blur a little and there's less instant assumption that girly girl = scenewhore. I could be wrong in that though, because I've made many friends at con so have less encounters with a stranger when I am alone, and I rarely dress like a girl anyways.

There is one phenomena I haven't seen discussed yet. At DC11 I had a very strange experience. While I was walking around with my wearable on, I saw males staring and whispering, pointing to me, yet everyone acted *afraid* to approach me. Seriously, no one once approached me while I was passing by a crowd, yet they were clearly watching and talking about me. One day I was sitting down at a table in the AP, trying to fix the stupid thing and a male approached me. He was litterally bending down (as if trying to get as close to my sitting level or smaller) and was incredibly hesitant, asking if perhaps it might be ok if he asked me a question? He acted like I (or god) would strike him down with lightening for talking to me. WTF?