Attending DEF CON 29 in-person? Please Read Me

[Dark Tangent]

If you are attending in-person, thank you for joining our adventure! It will a much different year than usual.

To stay as safe as possible we want to remind you of the safety rules you agreed to when purchasing your in-person badge. There are no exceptions to these rules:

• You must wear a proper mask at all times.
• You need to be fully vaccinated.

How it will work:
Starting Thursday at 07:00 badge pickup will open and you can start the 2-step process. There is no need to rush, if you have purchased on-line your badge is reserved and there is no concern about them running out:

1st you will pass through the vaccination check line, providing whatever original documentation your health care provider or vaccination center gave you. It will be checked against your State issued ID to make sure the names match, the dates are good, and that enough time has passed for you to be fully vaccinated, etc. We will not record your ID or records. If all is good you will get a WRISTBAND you must wear during the con.

2nd Next you head to the badge pickup desks. There you will show your wristband and your in-person badge bar code and get it scanned. If the scan passes you get your Human reg pack.

Congratulations! You have made it in.

To be considered a Human you will need to be wearing your badge and wristband. If for any reason you have to cut off your wristband or it gets damaged please bring the busted one back to registration to get checked again and be given a new one.

If you are not wearing your mask or don't have the badge or wristband you will be asked politely to meet the requirements previously stated. If you refuse you will be asked to leave the convention for everyone's safety.

We go into greater detail about everything in our DC 29 FAQ:
https://defcon.org/html/defcon-29/dc-29-faq.html

If you cannot meet these requirements then please participate virtually at:
https://discord.gg/defcon

More info about all the stuff happening:
https://defcon.org/html/defcon-29/dc-29-schedule.html
https://info.defcon.org/
https://forum.defcon.org/node/236142

The terms from the badge purchase:
https://shop.defcon.org/products/def-con-29

Thank you understanding the situation and see you in Las Vegas!

DEF CON

[DrPoppins85]

DT - I bought our tickets the day they went on sale. At that time, the policy was fully vaccinated, and you even commented on it. It was not, fully vaccinated plus 10 days. My wife and I both had COVID this past year, and it nearly killed me. It didnt, however, and my body fought it off. We will be fully vaccinated before the start of the CON, but not with this 10 days that has been added. Now, several legitimate studies show that a second dose only slightly increases antibody production in those who have natural antibodies due to being infected. Stats, blah whatever, boring. Point is, the rules changed after we bought tickets and planned our trip, and we ARE fully vaccinated, but I dont want to be stopped at the door day of due to some bs 10 day rule (which doesnt protect anyone from contracting or spreading the virus, only hopefully keeping them out of the hospital like me).
This is my 10 anniversary of DEFCON and my first with my wife!

[number6]

DT - I bought our tickets the day they went on sale. At that time, the policy was fully vaccinated, and you even commented on it. It was not, fully vaccinated plus 10 days. My wife and I both had COVID this past year, and it nearly killed me. It didnt, however, and my body fought it off. We will be fully vaccinated before the start of the CON, but not with this 10 days that has been added. Now, several legitimate studies show that a second dose only slightly increases antibody production in those who have natural antibodies due to being infected. Stats, blah whatever, boring. Point is, the rules changed after we bought tickets and planned our trip, and we ARE fully vaccinated, but I dont want to be stopped at the door day of due to some bs 10 day rule (which doesnt protect anyone from contracting or spreading the virus, only hopefully keeping them out of the hospital like me).
This is my 10 anniversary of DEFCON and my first with my wife!

I'm not Jeff or speaking for him.

According to CDC, on "fully vaccinated":
URL1=https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019...accinated.html

Have You Been Fully Vaccinated?
In general, people are considered fully vaccinated:
* 2 weeks after their second dose in a 2-dose series, such as the Pfizer or Moderna vaccines, or
* 2 weeks after a single-dose vaccine, such as Johnson & Johnson’s Janssen vaccine
If you don’t meet these requirements, regardless of your age, you are NOT fully vaccinated. Keep taking all precautions until you are fully vaccinated.

I don't set policy or make exceptions.

[number6]

When I visit:
https://shop.defcon.org/products/def-con-29
Here is what I see:

DEF CON 29 IN-PERSON TICKET ALL SALES FINAL
REGULAR PRICE$300.00
Quantity
Reduce item quantity by one +Increase item quantity by one
ADD TO CART
BUY IT NOW
Facebook Twitter Email
YOU ARE PURCHASING A DEF CON 29 TICKET FOR THE LAS VEGAS IN-PERSON CONFERENCE AUGUST 5-8, 2021. THE COST IS $300.
Your badge must be picked up on site.
Your badge also comes with a code that unlocks the "Human Plus" role on the DEF CON Discord Server. The DEF CON Discord is host to the online portion of DEF CON 29 and various other DEF CON Online Events during the rest of the year.
You will need to show proof of vaccination to collect your badge.
You will be required to wear a mask while on the conference floor.

human+ code given AT DC29 Registration

ALL SALES ARE FINAL

What do you see when you visit https://shop.defcon.org/products/def-con-29 ?

I don't have a history of what https://shop.defcon.org/products/def-con-29 included in its description in the past. For further questions about items on https://shop.defcon.org/ contact shop@defcon.org for someone who can provide you answers about items and issues with sales from https://shop.defcon.org/

I do not make or set policies for DEF CON or provide exceptions.
My primary realm is the forums, forum accounts, forum bugs, forum account registration, forum email, and dealing with spam and other forum rule violations.

[DrPoppins85]

https://shop.defcon.org/ and https://shop.defcon.org/products/def-con-29 are not the same, obviously. What do you see when you visit https://shop.defcon.org? I see
<image with href to https://shop.defcon.org/products/def-con-29>
<button>ADD TO CART
DEF CON 29 IN-PERSON TICKET ALL SALES FINAL
$300.00

If you click on Add to Cart, you get exactly what I stated and exactly what I experienced. If you click on the image, then you get taken to the product page, which I did not. I didnt write the code nor can I modify it but it remains exactly like that today. Probably removing the Add to Cart button forcing the customer to the product page and not allow direct checkout would have resolved this particular issue. Anyways, thanks again for the response and I apologize that you have to waste any time responding to this.

[number6]

If you click on Add to Cart, you get exactly what I stated and exactly what I experienced. If you click on the image, then you get taken to the product page, which I did not.

Thanks for clarifying. The issue you have is that the flow for purchase that you experienced did not include the same description as when you click on the item description. I can understand this as a complaint, but I cannot do anything about it. If there is an issue with the forums, that is a space I have control and authority to manage, upgrade and alter (within reason as Jeff can veto any potential change I might make.)

Voicing your concern with the flow and process you used when buying products as problematic are good to post here. Posting it here can allow others that see an issue with this flow, and give them an opportunity to find other solutions and propose them.

This is often made better with constructive criticism, which I infer that you implied as "adding requirements to the flow you completed when purchasing a badge." Please pass that as a suggestion to shop@defcon.org to see if that is a change they can make in the future.

Thanks for starting this conversation, and feel free to cultivate it on the forums, and encourage other people to join you in the discussion to find any other solutions, to offer constructive criticism to the https://shop.defcon.org/ website content.

[zustellr]

Just wanted to check that the EU digital vaccination certificates, which folks in Europe get, are also accepted as proof of vaccination. The FAQ only talks about a "original, signed, vaccination card", which is quite different from the QR code that we get over here. There are several apps available to check the code for validity.

Thanks!

More info on the certificate: EU Digital COVID Certificate | European Commission (europa.eu)
Validity app (the "official" one for Germany released by the RKI): CovPassCheck – Apps bei Google Play

[hjulemand]

Zustellr, I have to ask. How do you plan to enter USA with the current travel ban?

[zustellr]

@hjulemand: There are several exceptions to the rule, ranging from U.S. citizens, Green Card holders (lawful permanent residents), close family members of U.S. citizens or Green Card holders, people who have not been in the respective area in the 14 day time window (I heard about people spending two weeks in Mexico; not me, and nobody I know personally, but I heard this story), all the way up to people with "National Interest Exceptions" and diplomats. Let's say I consider myself one of the lucky few that fit one or more of those exceptions.

[zustellr]

Apologies for answering/replying to my own post. I found an answer from DT saying "bring what you were given" at Proof of Vaccination - DEF CON Forums, so I'll guess it will be fine.

[DrPoppins85]

Thanks for replying number6! As far as policy is concerned, the policy that I purchased the tickets under has changed. I am not disagreeing that attendees need to understand that they needed to be vaccinated (including me) if they wish to attend. I am saying that common-sense and medical studies show that in my case, we are "fully vaccinated".

In April, Cedars-Sinai researchers reported that in a study involving more than 260 health care workers, a single dose of the Pfizer vaccine given to those previously infected with COVID generated an antibody response similar to that of uninfected individuals who took the two-dose regimen. A study by University of Pennsylvania researchers, meanwhile, found that a single mRNA vaccine dose provided a “robust antibody response” and strong memory B cell responses in patients who had recovered from COVID-19—but that little benefit followed a second dose.Senior author John Wherry, director of the Penn Institute for Immunology, said in an emailthat the Penn data “are consistent with the idea that people who experienced natural infection do not benefit immunologically from two doses of mRNA vaccine,” though one dose may be useful in that regard.

[Cyph3r]

Question on this one. I will be picking up two badges that morning (both pre-paid). One is for me and the other is for my wife (trust me, you want her there to keep me out of trouble). Does she need to be there to get the badge or can she go to Human Services (i.e. DC29 guest services) with her documentation to get the wristband? Just need to know for planning purposes.

[number6]

I think I read that even if it might be possible for a person to pickup more than one badge, since a wrist-band is required for entry to DEF CON, the person who has proof of vaccination and ID needs to be present for the vaccine check to get their wrist band. Having a badge but no wrist-band doesn't get you access to in-person DEF CON. SO, even if possible to redeem multiple codes, (not sure it is), each person attending needs to provide proof of vaccination to get a wristband, so what is saved?

[ccw2777]

I have a virtual only badge but I live in Las Vegas. Can I go to the vendor booths? I really wanna look through and buy all of the cool merch. Also, are the vendor booths outside and do I need a pass to see them?

[number6]

I do not make policy for in-person DEF CON 29, but the present requirements for access to DEF CON 29 in-person (including the vendor area) is to meet the vaccination proof to get a wristband and an effective mask and an in-person badge. The present policies as of July 29, 2021 do not permit exceptions for virtual badge people to get access to in-person.

[Klipper12]

Greetings, I also had a question similar to what DrPoppins was asking about above.

When I purchased my ticket a month ago, it made mention of being fully vaccinated and wearing a mask at all times. No problem, I got an appointment scheduled for my vaccine rounds. It did not make any mention about the vaccine time frames, or having to wait two weeks after the second dose.
After purchasing my tickets at the beginning of the month I made arrangements with my work, in addition to reserving a hotel and airfare. All of those things are now locked in, and some (airfare) can not be canceled without incurring significant cancelation fees.

I got my second dose of vaccine two days ago (07/26), and saw the new information regarding vaccines must be before July 22nd. By the time I arrive on Thursday it'll be the 10th day since my vaccine.


What options are there for myself and others, as indicated via the above post, who spent considerable funds getting everything locked in for this trip? Will we be able to enter as long as we have a complete vaccination? Will we be able to either get a refund, or a credit for a future badge? I don't want to make the journey to Vegas for this incredible convention only to be turned away at the door.

[altman]

Not an official comment, but "fully vaccinated" is a defined term for the covid vaccines. It's 2 weeks after the second shot. Two shots plus sub 14 days means you are not fully vaccinated - the immunity takes time to develop. See CDC https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019...accinated.html

[altman]

Random non-vaccine related question:

I bought an in-person ticket/badge but am starting to have second thoughts about attending after checking prevalence of cases in Vegas. Yeah, I should have expected it would be bad (Vegas baby!), but I've spent over a year being more of a hermit than usual so I guess I can attempt to sit out the variants for a bit longer.

Two questions:

1. Can I get the badge mailed so I have my blinky souvenir, or does my $300 get me nothing if I don't turn up? (aside from the warm feeling of supporting DEFCON, which admittedly is still good)
2. Do people who paid for in-person get human plus on discord? I couldn't find any FAQ covering that. Human plus role recovery doesn't work as I didn't pay by paypal on store.defcon. #faw guidance to message #🙋-infobooth-closed seems bad as discord can't find that channel (or... it's closed)

Possibly not the best place to ask, but....

[number6]

1. Can I get the badge mailed so I have my blinky souvenir, or does my $300 get me nothing if I don't turn up? (aside from the warm feeling of supporting DEFCON, which admittedly is still good)

I don't make policy or issue exceptions.
The present details for in-person badge says:
URL1=https://shop.defcon.org/products/def-con-29

...
Your badge must be picked up on site.
...

2. Do people who paid for in-person get human plus on discord? I couldn't find any FAQ covering that. Human plus role recovery doesn't work as I didn't pay by paypal on store.defcon. #faw guidance to message #🙋-infobooth-closed seems bad as discord can't find that channel (or... it's closed)

The present details for the in-perspn badge says:
URL1=https://shop.defcon.org/products/def-con-29

...
Your badge also comes with a code that unlocks the "Human Plus" role on the DEF CON Discord Server. The DEF CON Discord is host to the online portion of DEF CON 29 and various other DEF CON Online Events during the rest of the year.
...

As I understand it, when the in-person DEF CON 29 badge is handed out in-person, a code for Human+ on the DEF CON Discord server is offered. which can then be redeemed online.
(People that ordered a badge for "DEF CON 29 Virtual" received a Human+ code for DEF CON Discord server, and many have been redeeming it on the discord server.)

[tijuanera]

Question: what do you all mean by "SIGNED" vaxx card? I sign it or I have to literally somehow get the Walgreens pharmacist to sign it even though there is no signature line on the standard CDC card issued to me back in April?

[number6]

Many vaccination cards are signed when issued. The important elements are to bring, "the original documentation your health care provider or vaccination center gave you" and the date of the last in the series towards "fully vaccinated" was long enough ago to meet CDC definitions for "Fully Vaccinated."

[tijuanera]

Thank you number6 ! Perfect. I shall bring my treasured and stamped card, as planned.

[2match]

Are any of the talks in person? The FAQ has "One of the big visible changes is that we have removed all in-person speaking tracks. " but the schedule has Track 1, Track 2, and only final one is listed as virtual.
Thanks,

[number6]

Villages are supposed to have live presentations, and there may be one or more interview which is also live, but I don't know about how all of these will be provided. It is possible they will be done in a room and piped out as video, or pre-recorded.

[Phantom81]

DT, I would highly suggest emailing everyone who has registered and let them know to bring original documentation. I was not planning on brining my CDC card with me until I stumbled upon this thread. I am sure there will be many others who are fully vaccinated but didnt think to bring their cards with them. I was planning on just showing my record on that CDC website on my phone if requested.

[number6]

Did you provide your email address when you purchased an in-person badge?

https://twitter.com/thedarktangent/s...34392827351040

He mentioned on twitter sending out an email reminder and notice which contained much of this same information (in this thread you are reading: https://forum.defcon.org/node/238509 ) to remind people of what is required to attend.

Check your junk/spam mail for an email from info@infocon.org to see if you received one.

Please let us know if you find an email message with similar content.

[Phantom81]

number6 I did not receive an email with any language like that. I have 2 emails from shop@mail.defcon.org and that was basically giving me my ticket and an order confirmation. That is why I was surprised to hear this first on the forums.

[number6]

Thanks for confirming you included an email address when you purchased a badge and never received an email from info@infocon.org. Would you please send us an email letting us know which email address you used for getting notifications when you got a badge? email to forum@defcon.org or you can send me a DM on the forums. I can ask Jeff if he can find that email address in the list of addresses he sent the reminder, and I can check mail logs to see what they report on delivery of that message to that address. (This offer is limited time offer as mail logs will roll off soon, and I won't be able to check email addresses.)