Vote - Defcon 12 100$usd

[blackwave]

KEEP THE SKRIPT KIDDIES AWAY... VOTE TODAY!

[ripshy]

no way man, my mom won't give me that much...

Thanks BW, that one really made me laugh.

[DrStrangeCheese]

Throw in a T-shirt and I'm in.

[blackwave]

Originally posted by 0versight
I dont think a 25 dollars increase will keep the skript kiddies away.

100 dollars is really not that much to save up especially when you have one whole entire year to do so.

Do you know how many emails I got saying "Sorry BW, I won't be able to make it this year, ran out of funds... " ? ... I would say more than 10... for some reason there are a lot of procrastinators out there who seem to use their last payhcheck right before the con to see if they can go or not... I think 100$ will kill a lot of these last minute ppl, as well as people who feel they can spend more credits on evercrack than use it on DEFCON...

[Chris]

Originally posted by 0versight

You would really kill the skript kiddies if you somehow got the AP and all the hotels in Vegas to raise their fees.

Are you on CRACK? Screw the SK's...not ME dammit.

[blackwave]

here are some more ideas:

21+ (this will shave a lot of sk's right off)
charge more (this will take care of the rest... )
... only allow so many ticket sales so that assures x tickets will have x seats for all talks.. if ticket holder does not show up to talk there is an empty seat that never gets filled...

have more interactive things to keep people constructively busy, this means less party time, meaning less sk's... but fun enough to keep the hacker brain entertained and interested... you don't want to pay somewhere you are happy.

[ck3k]

My feelings :

the raise, sure it is worth a try, and if it can get some neato new stuff at the con, or go to prizes for contests, sure thing.

the 21 year thing, I am saying no to due to my age, I would not be able to attend, even tho I would do it anyways, course, I leave my id in the car alot...;) *cough* quarks *cough* :D

[ripshy]

Originally posted by blackwave

21+ (this will shave a lot of sk's right off)

Have you gone MAD? Actually, Im only pissed because Im 15, but this would keep alot of the SK's away. Maybe we could grant a special kind of ticket for people who are under 21, and can somehow prove themselves.

OR, it would just cost me $200 to get into the con, including cost of new ID (a good one, mind you).

[MindShadow]

Extra Cost

I know plenty of people who stopped coming after the jump from 50 (I think I remember it being 50 at DC 8) to 75, so a jump to 100 may keep some people out... you just want to make sure if you are doing it to keep people out, you are keeping out the right people.

As far as a girlfriend/boyfriend badge, frankly if they come and they are a body, they should have to pay like everyone else, otherwise you risk "badge sharing".

Perhaps raising the initial cost to say even 150 but ensuring that the AP provides decent food (that pizza is so god damn nasty) and liquor prices that are reasonable would work... also maybe having the AP hire security that is pre-retirement age may be a plus. This could also provide money for speakers, programs, badges etc.

Just an idea.

[nulltone]

Originally posted by blackwave
21+ (this will shave a lot of sk's right off)

That'd get rid of... 20-30% of the total attendance?
Oh yeah, and blackwave? I'm never talking to you again.

[Gadsden]

I rather not see economics be used as a deterrent for the script kiddie problem... there are lots of kiddies that get a large enough allowance to afford to get in, so then you have the spoiled ones that are much worse. Also, I know lots of very cool folks that attended the con on a VERY slim budget, and the extra $25 could be enough to keep them away.
Cool folks can be poor too.

As for the age requirement, I feel that would be the same trap. While I think it would be more effective than economic means, it would screw over too many folks that are very worthy of attending, while the older wankers can still get in.

While I am against those two means of dealing with the asshat problem, I really have no ideas at the moment other than giving the goons cattle prods and a million bucks in liabality insurance.
Let's face it, anytime you get a large crowd of people together, there will be a flock of assclowns in the bunch.

[Zhym]

Lamers don't have money?

Sure, an extra $25 might reduce the crowd, but is there any correlation between lamers and money? Given the number of digital cameras I saw flashing any time it looked like someone would flash tit, most of the goobers at Defcon have plenty of money.

Or, it might not reduce the crowd. I spent way more than that $25 on hotel and airfare, and can lose more in five minutes at a blackjack table. An extra $25 charge might mean I buy one less T-shirt, but it won't keep me (or most people, I think) away.

I sort of like the "girlfriend badge" idea (or "scene" badge, or "party" badge, or "no-session" badge). Let the folks who just want to party do so, and leave more room in the sessions.

What Defcon really needs is a "dipshit badge". Do something really stupid, and the dipshit badge gets affixed to your forehead with superglue. Might make the goons' jobs easier.

[converge]

hmmm very fun topic indeed... and quite played out. Here is my current mindset. I need no reason from the Defcon executive as to why the cost may be raised. It is plain to see that they are not doing this to be rich and famous off the masses of hackers and sheep. If it were raised to $100, $150, whatever.. I would pay it. I like the conference and find it quite worthwhile.

However, I don't believe that raising the cost of the con would result proportionally in SK droppage. In fact... some of the more bitchy attendees don't seem to have trouble in the money area.. raising price would only hit those that don't rely on mom/dad/etc money to get out there. The ones paying their own tab are already likely to not be of the fucktard persuation... .. well... likely.

[pezz]

Why don't you create a testing procedure which allows for those who answer questions correctly to get in. Do you honestly think a scene whore would know what ODBC stood for?

They could be rather easy questions that would be common for all in computers to answer but difficult for those who didn't have a clue.


CPU, Whats the difference between static and dynamic ip's?, etc..

[Chris]

Originally posted by pezz
Why don't you create a testing procedure which allows for those who answer questions correctly to get in. Do you honestly think a scene whore would know what ODBC stood for?

They could be rather easy questions that would be common for all in computers to answer but difficult for those who didn't have a clue.


CPU, Whats the difference between static and dynamic ip's?, etc..

An interesting idea, however, and please remember I speak for myself not for DT or DefCon as a whole, I think that we should encourage newbies at DefCon. Not skript kiddies, but people who may not KNOW anything per se but want to learn.

If we exclude based on current knowledge, who decides what is easy? Personally, I have pretty much memorized what service/trojan/program runs on pretty much every port. To ME these are easy questions, but I commonly run into extremely intelligent, competent SA's who don't have a clue what runs on port 143. Should these people be excluded because I think ports are easy?

Some people couldn't answer an acronym question to save their lives. They would have no clue the differnece between DoS and DOS. But they could tell you the difference if you asked them without the acronyms.

I think the idea of purging the uninformed is wrong. If you are willing to pay, you get in. My personal opinion runs more toward the concept of limiting badges to a set number (4000 would be my choice) and then requiring pre-registration. The obvious problem with this idea is that we lose our anonymity. This isn't a problem for me since I use my real name...but Blackwave would have a fit.:D