What are you views on cheating?

[Ridirich]

I am not the most well-worded person in the world. As a matter of fact I stink at putting my ideas out of my head.


I meant, if you are playing a WW2 game, or a Vietnam game or a current army game, all of which are revolving around true occurances, during WW2, Vietnam or even in the current army, were/are there bullets that go around corners?

[edit]Think of the movie "Runaway" where there were heat seeking bullets.[/edit]

[TheCotMan]

I meant, if you are playing a WW2 game, or a Vietnam game or a current army game, all of which are revolving around true occurances, during WW2, Vietnam or even in the current army, were/are there bullets that go around corners?

[edit]Think of the movie "Runaway" where there were heat seeking bullets.[/edit]

Ok. Like 3D FPS. If there were such weapons in real life, would use of them be cheating in war in real life? ]:>

[hackajar]

Ok. Like 3D FPS. If there were such weapons in real life, would use of them be cheating in war in real life? ]:>

See now that's a trick questions. It's almost like "If we were in medevil times, and had rockets to compeate with their bows..." Technology always (Vetnam excluded) won the wars. Sorta like 'he who has the biggest gun wins' kind of thing, no?

[Floydr47]

Ok. :-)
A covert and violent attack against non-military targets meant to generate fear or terror for the purpose of advancing one or more items in your agenda, or to harm the advancement of your enemies agenda.


How about just the last part? Is Terrorism cheating?

That would depend on how you interpret "terrorism" If a small impoverished country were invaded by a larger and more powerful country and a citizen army were formed in the smaller country would they be terrorists or freedom fighters? If they are to be called terrorists then wouldn't that make the founding fathers of the United States terrorists? If they are to be called freedom fighter wouldn't that make the IRA freedom fighters? Is attacking the homeland of people who have invaded your country really terrorism? On the subject of "cheating", if a C student cheats on tests to get an A and he/she constantly gets away without being caught, goes on to college and med school, wouldn't the end result be a C average doctor performing life and death surgeries? If you pass a co-workers desk and happen to see a diagram of a new invetion/idea/program/whatever and you can see a way to make improvements on the diagram, if you do this and then submit it as your own work is that cheating?

[Ridirich]

Ok, in real life, during war...anything goes. The only "real life" cheating that matters to me are the following:

A) If my girlfriend/wife goes cheats on me with another man(lack of respect, decietfulness)

B) Cheating on exams during school(the cheater shows disrespect through lazieness, decietfulness)

C) Cheating in tech-classes/work prep/college where you most assuredly need those classes to excel in your field.(This could cause the death of simply 1 person at a time, if you are a doctor/medic/nurse...or hundreds if you are a biologist/pharmacist. Shows a severe lazieness problem, extreme lack of respect, decietfulness)

D) Cheating with your work on the job site. (Possible injury to others, lazieness, lack of respect, decietfulness)

Seeing a pattern here? If the cheating involves injuring/killing someone, lack of respect, lies, lazieness...then it ticks me off.

In videogames, cheating is wrong, period. I do not mind hardware being faster, netspeeds being quicker, skills being better...those all come with the territory.

Speedhacks, Wallhacks, Aimbots, ESP, Auto-clickers....these are all unfair advantages that were not built into the game and are not a hardware/user variable. They do not belong.

Sure. If someone comes up with an inventive way to be better using the hardware/user variable I am all for it, but not installing 3rd party software into games that does not belong there.

[TheCotMan]

See now that's a trick questions. It's almost like "If we were in medevil times, and had rockets to compeate with their bows..." Technology always (Vetnam excluded) won the wars. Sorta like 'he who has the biggest gun wins' kind of thing, no?

Engineering, precision and technology do not guarantee wins. Consider the Roman empire and the "barbarians." I have more recent examples from the 20th century, but want to avoid them because they tend to evoke strong feelings from people in discussions.

That would depend on how you interpret "terrorism" If a small impoverished country were invaded by a larger and more powerful country and a citizen army were formed in the smaller country would they be terrorists or freedom fighters?

By the definition of terrorism provided, such a group could be both. The key items in the definition is the key-use of "non-military targets." The difficulty comes in definition of "non-military target" and "terror"

If they are to be called terrorists then wouldn't that make the founding fathers of the United States terrorists?

Perhaps those who covertly and violently attacked non-military targets to generate fear in order to helps items on their agenda or harm items on the enemies agenda, could be considered terrorists by the offered definition.

How do you know? What is a non-military target? What is covert?

Is a ball bearing manufacturing plant a military target if it is run by civillians, but the ball bearings are used in machines of war? I chose the definition so that it could be viewed to cover many things and be accepted by many. (Power plants, TV stations, radio stations, communication relays (cell phones, telecommunications relays), dams, bridges, etc.) Is something that can be used by the military, a military target? Heh-heh.

On the subject of "cheating", if a C student cheats on tests to get an A and he/she constantly gets away without being caught, goes on to college and med school, wouldn't the end result be a C average doctor performing life and death surgeries? If you pass a co-workers desk and happen to see a diagram of a new invetion/idea/program/whatever and you can see a way to make improvements on the diagram, if you do this and then submit it as your own work is that cheating?

Good questions. Let's see where they go. :-)

[Floydr47]

I think that cheating, morals, ethics are ambiguos terms at best. The standards of what is and what is not cheating are set by the peer group that a person belongs to. As an example: If I own a collection of Jimi Hendrix records (old 45's, 33 1/3's) and I join a P2P community for the purpose of downloading the songs that I have in my collection in order to burn them to CD to play in my car, would that be considered stealing? If I have already purchased license to the music when I bought the albums do I then own rights to the song in every form of medium? If a person pays the price of admission to a movie and then downloads the movie for private viewing, hasn't he already paid for the license to do so when he originally bought his ticket at the theater? If this is true then "cheating" is defined by what is morally and ethically correct for the community to which one belongs. For instance, the moral and ethical climate of Las Vegas differs greatly from the moral and ethical climate of Salt Lake City. What is acceptable in one city isn't in the other. What is unacceptable moral/ecthical behavior to the members of this forum may be entirely acceptable to the members another forum. This is a great thread Cotman, thank you for starting it. It has forced me to examine my own moral and ethical standards....

[Second]

If I own a collection of Jimi Hendrix records (old 45's, 33 1/3's) and I join a P2P community for the purpose of downloading the songs that I have in my collection in order to burn them to CD to play in my car, would that be considered stealing? If I have already purchased license to the music when I bought the albums do I then own rights to the song in every form of medium? If a person pays the price of admission to a movie and then downloads the movie for private viewing, hasn't he already paid for the license to do so when he originally bought his ticket at the theater?

I think in regards to the music, it wouldn't be considered stealing because you physically have access and physically own the material. With the movie, you are esentially agreeing by buying the ticket that you are paying to view the film one time. That's why you can't just buy a ticket and keep coming back to the movie over and over again. I don't know the laws pertaining to the film and music industry, those are only my thoughts.

[nak]

Sorry if this is bringing back a dead thread

I was going through some of my old digital camera pictures and found these from high school:
http://www.hackingisfun.com/images/PICT0182.JPG
http://www.hackingisfun.com/images/PICT0183.JPG
http://www.hackingisfun.com/images/PICT0184.JPG
= live examples of cheating in motion.

The assignment was to copy all these definitions out of the book's glossary. What is one to learn from that? It doesnt make you read any harder when you read it from a book or from another paper.

But, by doing this I am "cheating" the hassle of buying my book, flipping around the rear pages and reading really small text (yeah I passed english 102 without buying a book). I didn't think this was morally wrong at the time. Looking back, I see that this other kid had to spend the extra time working to get the answers out of the book, but was it wrong for me to take pictures of it go home and copy it? Heh, I don't know... saving 80 bucks vs cheating the system a little.