Ninja party is canceled this year

[0x58]

Re: Ninja party is canceled this year

Since this year is going to be my second year at DefCon, I was hoping to be invited to the Ninja party, if only to have one of the cool metal badges.

Since last year was my first, I do not know how it was back at AP, and the history behind it, but I personally have not had much trouble with the Riv, then again I am not much of a trouble maker.

I read the post by DT that DefCon is looking for a new Hotel, and that is good news, however how many hotels would be willing to put up with a bunch of hackers, and still be affordable? Black Hat is at Ceasars and if my mind serves me well, it was as far away from any slot machines, ATM's and other electronic devices as they were able to put it.

While I am sad that this year there is not even a chance for me to acquire said badge, I feel that DefCon needs to continue moving the goalposts. When LosT started his challenge it was meant to get more people involved in hardware. DefCon has its traditions, but maybe it is time to move on, and get something new together? Tradition is the easy path to take, and most of the time offers the least resistance. Think of something new, come up with something so radical that no-one else had thought of it yet. We are all hackers, lets all think out loud on these here forums and come up with something.

* Any and all contradictions in this post thanks to my sleep deprived state.

[jedi]

Re: Ninja party is canceled this year

Like anything else in life- Defcon each year is what you make it. Shit happens, we deal. I agree we should give the Riv as little of our money as possible. I also agree with Converge's ideas of more impromptu antics. Continue to hack the system.

The suggestions of using services like Dodgeball and Twitter are a step in the right direction then.

[LosT]

Re: Ninja party is canceled this year

Like anything else in life- Defcon each year is what you make it. Shit happens, we deal. I agree we should give the Riv as little of our money as possible. I also agree with Converge's ideas of more impromptu antics. Continue to hack the system.

LosT

[jedi]

Re: Ninja party is canceled this year

This year we can't help but stay at the Riv, but I think trying to spend as little money as you can otherwise should send a message.

Since dc is at the Riv at least one more year, the hilton's always an option. If the con dates sync up with the trek convention again, it'd be easy to use the discount the trek attendees get:

The Hilton offers a special lower than normal room rate of $135 a night to those staying with the convention. MENTION STAR TREK CONVENTION WHEN YOU BOOK BY CALLING 1-800-635-7711 The hotel has advised that fans calling in can get this special rate just by asking for the Star Trek Convention they do not need the group code, however it is SSTR8R if the agent answering the phone has trouble finding it.

But I don't think that's the right option. It'll more than likely come back to bite the organizers in the ass in some way.

[Dark Tangent]

Re: Ninja party is canceled this year

Just so everyone knows, searching for a replacement location is a nightmare that takes a lot of work by a lot of people. I always like to keep my eye out, just to make sure we are competitive with our hotel contracts, but I will be doing a search of Vegas to see what, if any, alternatives exist.

DEFCON 17 is signed for the Riv, 2009, but after that anything goes.

[Ne0nRa1n]

Re: Ninja party is canceled this year

I don't really drink, and I've never drank at a DEFCON. (I've had one sip of alcohol in the nine years I've been going.) I must admit though that this situation has me seriously consider starting just so I can buy booze somewhere else.

It is obvious that the Ninja party has been totally screwed over by the Riv. I don't blame them for calling it quits. It is obvious they are fighting a losing battle. I don't blame them for not wanting to do anything offsite either, because it isn't 'part' of DEFCON then. It becomes something else.

The truly sad thing is that you just know this is going to affect the rest of the 'private' parties this year too.

So, I am going to do the only thing that I can do until DEFCON moves to another hotel and try to give the Riv as little as my money as possible, and encourage others to do the same. Yes, I know we aren't talking about a lot of money here - but I have no desire to PAY someone for the honour of letting them fuck my friends over.

I will keep a flask on me so I don't support their bar. I will bring instant oatmeal and eat in my hotel room instead of eating their food for breakfast.

I mean, what else can one do? I am into fucking shit up as much as the next person, but not at the risk of making the conference pay for it.

[r3db0x]

Re: Ninja party is canceled this year

Don't gamble, don't use thier bars, don't get food at their food court.

Did you ever? Ew.

While many of the projects turn out amazing, not *everything* has to be a large, coordinated, overthought contest/event/undergoing.

Hear hear. This is why we have cell phones, forums, Twitter and so on. Also why we have eyes and ears. My favorite parties are always the impromptu gatherings of like-minded drunks... Large, uber-organized events get to feeling like a night at a club - something most of us could do outside of DefCon.

As a con-goer who already has half a hotel room full of decor loaded into a box ready for dispersal in a Riviera Standard, I say, bring on the grassroots endrunkening!

[converge]

Re: Ninja party is canceled this year

I thought smaller, roaming, regular parties were part of what people missed from the Alexis? I'm normally a glass is half empty kind of guy, but I think a lot of potential for positive is being overlooked, especially without burning Defcon/Riv as a whole.

I see over-organization on the part of attendees as being one of the largest detriments to the current Defcon outlay. 85% of folks show up for the show being made for them, 10% doing random things and 5% organizing stuff for the other 85% to show up to. Many folks in the 5% have been wanting to drag the 85% into this, while a fraction of the 10% is kicking back wishing Defcon were the way it was 'back in the good ol days'. More and more people are taking part, but doing so by starting more over-organized events leaving the others to think that is the requirement and not the extraneous.

While many of the projects turn out amazing, not *everything* has to be a large, coordinated, overthought contest/event/undergoing. Four long strips of duct tape and 8 smashed players gets an impromptu hallway game of drunk-tac-toe. <$100 and a trip to walmart gets you a pool filled with pudding. These are dumb ideas .. I'm confident much of Defcon is brighter than me. Harmless fun. Do it dammit.

People need to show up, be themself, and aim for a goal.. I personally like common drunktitude.

[Abby_Normal]

Re: Ninja party is canceled this year

Until we get shut down. I'm pretty sure, with what's going on around us, we'll be reduced to a bunch of flash mobs this year.

I'm sure there will be stuff to do. The problem I see is by breaking up the big gatherings they have caused many, many smaller, often floating ones.

So instead of containing the fire in one place, they've caused them to spead all over the place. Way to go Riv, good thining there.

I really think the Riv thinks if they kill all the fun, and take away all the parties, we will give up and be good little sheep and go spend money in their casino and bars. They don't know us very well.

I wouldn't gamble at the Riv if it was the last casino on earth.

[cereal76]

Re: Ninja party is canceled this year

Seriously though .. it sucks the Ninja party is out, but I am *confident* that a group of us sitting around an empty room can come up with _something_ extremely fun to do somewhere in Vegas that approaches a level of debauchery.

Until we get shut down. I'm pretty sure, with what's going on around us, we'll be reduced to a bunch of flash mobs this year.

[converge]

Re: Ninja party is canceled this year

But, where else can we locate such fine cuisine and hotter slots?? And with the Riv's tight grip on alcohol in Nevada .. surely we are fucked.

Seriously though .. it sucks the Ninja party is out, but I am *confident* that a group of us sitting around an empty room can come up with _something_ extremely fun to do somewhere in Vegas that approaches a level of debauchery.

Discussing coordinated plans to take down The System at the hotel hosting us on a public forum, that Riv management/workers probably tail due to relavance .. is probably not so fruitful as it sounds in your head and not going to instill a sense of good faith in the Hotel staff that we disagree with.

It's extrememly late in the game to come up with a coordinated plan for fun .. particularly off property. Let's find spawning points to meet up with friends and decide where to take the fun from there.

I'm of the opinion that we don't have to jeorpardize Defcon or the Riv to have equal or greater fun. We just have to think before we do.

[Gadsden]

Re: Ninja party is canceled this year

I personally like the idea of having Flea "Assclub" everything he can.. especially the phones. Photos are a must!

[Abby_Normal]

Re: Ninja party is canceled this year

Hey now, don't pervert the camelbak idea into some sort of lame "protest."

What will you achieve with the protest? How will this action translate into your goal being achieved? What is your goal, precisely?

How many people will "protest?" 10? 100? 200?
The riv isn't going to notice such numbers. It would have to be every con attendee to be noticed. Such a thing would have to come right from DT, as such a power move would have to be well thought out by someone with all the information and the leadership to have someone listen to him. Even then, it may or may not have the intended effect. Otherwise, this protest is just an impotent emo charade followed by an insignificant number of people.

BTW, are you staying in a room at the Riv? That is supporting them just as surely, even if you did not directly pay for the room.

This year we can't help but stay at the Riv, but I think trying to spend as little money as you can otherwise should send a message.

Don't gamble, don't use thier bars, don't get food at their food court.

But everyone will have to do it for it to be noticed.

I think the biggest message we can send is when we leave.

[mfreeck]

Re: Ninja party is canceled this year

I think the whole don't use facilities on the premises is the best way to go. Not using their bars, restaurants, or casino in protest. Im also for the whole camel back thing.

Hey now, don't pervert the camelbak idea into some sort of lame "protest."

What will you achieve with the protest? How will this action translate into your goal being achieved? What is your goal, precisely?

How many people will "protest?" 10? 100? 200?
The riv isn't going to notice such numbers. It would have to be every con attendee to be noticed. Such a thing would have to come right from DT, as such a power move would have to be well thought out by someone with all the information and the leadership to have someone listen to him. Even then, it may or may not have the intended effect. Otherwise, this protest is just an impotent emo charade followed by an insignificant number of people.

BTW, are you staying in a room at the Riv? That is supporting them just as surely, even if you did not directly pay for the room.

[[Syntax]]

Re: Ninja party is canceled this year

I think the whole don't use facilities on the premises is the best way to go. Not using their bars, restaurants, or casino in protest. Im also for the whole camel back thing.

Im wondering if this is the result of management finding that casino and bar revenue went down during the convention, or just them trying to squeeze another nickel out of everyone regardless of hotel profits during the convention.