Ninja party is canceled this year

[Abby_Normal]

Re: Ninja party is canceled this year

Yea, I remember that night, we were VERY careful about ID's and such, that kid came from nowhere at almost the same sec everyone from the PD to Sec showed up. In retrospect it was a setup.

Of course it was.

If you recall, their reason for coming in to the room last year was a lie as well. They claimed to have a report of "something" being thrown out a window, which changed every time they brought it up. We didn't hand out any drinks in anything other than small plastic cups.

LVPD came in, said there was nothing illegal going on and left. They seemed annoyed at being called.

The Riv has never been honest, and have tried to screw all of us every chance they get. What kind of hotel rents you a room with a bar in it, then charges you for a bottle opener?

I've gotten better and more professional treatment from the Embassy Suites, hell, even a motel 6!

The sooner the Riv is gone the better.

[Dallas]

Re: Ninja party is canceled this year

Yea, I remember that night, we were VERY careful about ID's and such, that kid came from nowhere at almost the same sec everyone from the PD to Sec showed up. In retrospect it was a setup.

Chris:

I think his point is more, that people should have taken notice that this was a growing trend and was generally harsh treatment for the acts performed. A bad precedent was set right from the get-go.

Not to harp on what happened to me, but...

I specifically worked with the housing coordinator, Toni Goldsmith, telling the hotel exactly what to expect. Toni rented me that room stating, "If I were holding a gathering, this is the room I'd chose." Considering that NO OTHER party had ever worked with the hotel in that fashion prior to our party and they knew exactly what to expect: I find their actions to be despicable.

They were informed I'd have my own booze.
They were informed I'd have my own food.
They were informed I'd staff the event myself, and provide my own security.
They were told to expect a rotating crowd of 50-100 people.

Still I was hit with fines that I was not informed of even though I talked with the hotel numerous times and they could have told me at any time that I was violating some policy and to expect punishment.

Their tactics are only slightly short of extortion and entrapment.

This is not to even mention Riv security tried to have me **PUT IN JAIL** by having an undercover *underage* security agent say he was staying in my room in front of LVPD and several witnesses (which no one in the room had *ever* seen that kid before and the 'stuff' he allegedly stored in my room was no where to be found.)

The previous story isn't even one I ever whined about.. Point is, if they did it to me, *why* did the other parties think they were impervious. The Riv hasn't treated *any* of us fairly *yet*

Yes I know the local workers are actually quite friendly. I'm pretty sure I'm putting the maid for top of the riv's kid through college; it's all upper management and the security office.

When I tried to tell people this was a problem, I was told I was over-reacting. I firmly believe people thought I was just working to try and wiggle out of my punishment, even though I stated numerous times that I'd accept the consequences of my actions, but was worried about the others and the conference.

I think overall the point is; You need to pay attention to evil injustices happening around you, even if you can't do anything to help them today, they might be coming for *you* tomorrow.

[icetre]

Re: Ninja party is canceled this year

Chris:

I think his point is more, that people should have taken notice that this was a growing trend and was generally harsh treatment for the acts performed. A bad precedent was set right from the get-go.

Not to harp on what happened to me, but...

I specifically worked with the housing coordinator, Toni Goldsmith, telling the hotel exactly what to expect. Toni rented me that room stating, "If I were holding a gathering, this is the room I'd chose." Considering that NO OTHER party had ever worked with the hotel in that fashion prior to our party and they knew exactly what to expect: I find their actions to be despicable.

They were informed I'd have my own booze.
They were informed I'd have my own food.
They were informed I'd staff the event myself, and provide my own security.
They were told to expect a rotating crowd of 50-100 people.

Still I was hit with fines that I was not informed of even though I talked with the hotel numerous times and they could have told me at any time that I was violating some policy and to expect punishment.

Their tactics are only slightly short of extortion and entrapment.

This is not to even mention Riv security tried to have me **PUT IN JAIL** by having an undercover *underage* security agent say he was staying in my room in front of LVPD and several witnesses (which no one in the room had *ever* seen that kid before and the 'stuff' he allegedly stored in my room was no where to be found.)

The previous story isn't even one I ever whined about.. Point is, if they did it to me, *why* did the other parties think they were impervious. The Riv hasn't treated *any* of us fairly *yet*

Yes I know the local workers are actually quite friendly. I'm pretty sure I'm putting the maid for top of the riv's kid through college; it's all upper management and the security office.

When I tried to tell people this was a problem, I was told I was over-reacting. I firmly believe people thought I was just working to try and wiggle out of my punishment, even though I stated numerous times that I'd accept the consequences of my actions, but was worried about the others and the conference.

I think overall the point is; You need to pay attention to evil injustices happening around you, even if you can't do anything to help them today, they might be coming for *you* tomorrow.

Just out of curiosity, what exactly did you expect us to do?
"Excuse me officer, I know that the property has asked you to remove these people from the premises, but you may note, I am a Goon. Now unhand this man and allow us to return to our debauchery post haste!"

No one has ever disagreed that you guys got hosed, but to constantly act like we could do anything about it is getting a tad irritating. So tell me, what was the staff supposed to do to help you? If the hotel calls Metro on me I can guarantee you that nothing can be done. It's between the hotel, me and metro at that point.

[cereal76]

Re: Ninja party is canceled this year

"Excuse me officer, I know that the property has asked you to remove these people from the premises, but you may note, I am a Goon. Now unhand this man and allow us to return to our debauchery post haste!"

uhm, debauchery? I was at the DC groups meet.

Anyways, I don't want to hijack the thread, and I know that once things escalated to a certain point there was little that could be done for anyone. That's really not what I meant by my post anyways, although now that I re-read it, it sounds that way.

I just find it curious that people are now just figuring out that the Riviera really doesn't care about the con or it's patrons. That's all.

[russ]

Re: Ninja party is canceled this year

Yeah, the contract is signed through next year. We're there through 2009, period. Besides, red shirts don't actually HAVE supernatural powers... thus, a bullet still kills a goon. And it doesn't even have to be silver.

Just out of curiosity, what exactly did you expect us to do?
"Excuse me officer, I know that the property has asked you to remove these people from the premises, but you may note, I am a Goon. Now unhand this man and allow us to return to our debauchery post haste!"

No one has ever disagreed that you guys got hosed, but to constantly act like we could do anything about it is getting a tad irritating. So tell me, what was the staff supposed to do to help you? If the hotel calls Metro on me I can guarantee you that nothing can be done. It's between the hotel, me and metro at that point.

[Chris]

Re: Ninja party is canceled this year

I couldn't agree more with Icetre. I couldn't believe everyone turned a blind eye while we all escorted off the property by Riv security and LVM during DC14. Adding insult to injury was my black badge being confiscated by LVM only to become a trophy for some security guard.

Just out of curiosity, what exactly did you expect us to do?
"Excuse me officer, I know that the property has asked you to remove these people from the premises, but you may note, I am a Goon. Now unhand this man and allow us to return to our debauchery post haste!"

No one has ever disagreed that you guys got hosed, but to constantly act like we could do anything about it is getting a tad irritating. So tell me, what was the staff supposed to do to help you? If the hotel calls Metro on me I can guarantee you that nothing can be done. It's between the hotel, me and metro at that point.

[cereal76]

Re: Ninja party is canceled this year

I couldn't agree more with Icetre. I couldn't believe everyone turned a blind eye while we all escorted off the property by Riv security and LVM during DC14. Adding insult to injury was my black badge being confiscated by LVM only to become a trophy for some security guard.

I guess I'm just surprised that it took the Ninja party getting canceled, and not ~10 con-goers (3 of which were black badge holders) getting kicked out of the con for people to notice that the Riv is slowly killing Defcon.

Not to be all, I told you so or nothing, but this is exactly what I was saying at DC14 when I got kicked square in the nuts. I wasn't worried about *my* party, but *all* of our parties! I bitched to EVERYONE trying to tell them the very dangerous precident that was being set. I was trying to do my part to help the convention to learn from the experience.

Some sympathized, but few actually seemed to do anything. I offered to stay and attend meetings with the hotel and defcon to explain what happened and/or smooth things out for next year... What did I get for my trouble and concern? Banned from hotel grounds for 'Unruly behavior' despite the fact that the hotel was 100% aware of what I intended to do.

[ndex]

Re: Ninja party is canceled this year



I look forward to a *hand full* of parties a year. For the rest of the YEAR I am a complete angel. I travel to the asshole of the universe, LAS VEGAS NEVADA for the sole purpose of attending THESE PARTIES with THESE PEOPLE. We already sold out their shitty hotel, we already over tip their staff for their watered down drinks and crappy food. They ripped us off and treated us like crap last year and we were nice to them - AGAIN.

You offered them CASH MONEY and they wanted more?

It's seems to me if I'm not at your party drinking your booze that I'm just inclined to get into all kinds of trouble (makes a note to buy spray paint). I'm certainly not going to gamble, eat or go to their lousy bar.

With all this time on my hands and no one making me drink their booze, I can't see this ending well.

Let's see, if I wasn't at a party what's my alibi...

[mfreeck]

Re: Ninja party is canceled this year

This is something we should do if, and only if, we're burning the Riv. Out of respect to con, and the already near-impossibility of finding hotels in Vegas willing to host it, this should not be done.

However, I really do like the idea of decentralized debauchery. It has a nice ring to it.

I was not so much proposing that it should be done as that there's a good chance it may happen. I know personally that if i do not expect booze to be provided via tip bar, then I will likely bring my own. The choice is not binary as riveria is thinking it is - providing your own alcohol is far cheaper than paying $6-8 per watered down drink and this crowd is generally more willing to do the slight extra work than most folks.

[signine]

Re: Ninja party is canceled this year

I understand the ninjas can't take a chance on a big organized party this year, but I predict with the slap down put on organized parties, the party will just metastisize.

Really the Riv should be thinking about what happens when the party is every defcon attendee wandering the hotel. Is it easier to deal with 500 drunken people in one room, or 4000 mobile bartenders?

This is something we should do if, and only if, we're burning the Riv. Out of respect to con, and the already near-impossibility of finding hotels in Vegas willing to host it, this should not be done.

However, I really do like the idea of decentralized debauchery. It has a nice ring to it.

Technically I think the wording was "Sorry, the stripper was sitting on my PTT" :)

It's true, it was, but I was trying to be vague. I also recall a statement from the same party "OH GOD, SHE GOT PUBES IN MY MOUTH."

I have _PRICELESS_ video footage of Junk walking down the hallway towards those approaching security guards, waving his arms. They were amazingly cool about it, to their credit.

It's true, they really were. I was certain they were going to kill us all when I first saw them, but that might have been the fear.

I think that was at MiniCon 2, wasn't it? Or was that ShadyCon? They all blur together. I think it was MiniCon 2.

It's also worth noting that MiniCon 2 was probably the first event in history to initiate a full-scale Las Vegas Strip hotel evacuation within 10 minutes (literally ten minutes) of entering the premises. Granted, they called it off within about 3 minutes, but it's still notable. Also, it was totally the Rio's fault for putting a smoke detector DIRECTLY ABOVE A PUBLIC ASHTRAY, but I digress.

This was the same con where someone who shall remain unnamed brought a fifth of jack to the breakfast table on Sunday morning, and people were mixing drinks, which made the waitress say something like, "You're the kind of guys that have a bar in your car." and Pesto shot back (without missing a beat), "No, but I do have another waitress in my trunk."

That is in my top ten favorite con moments of all time.

(For the record, MiniCon 2 was all TProphet's fault.)

It was MiniCon 2, and I am proposing, and I know this is horrible, another MiniCon, but we can take that discussion off the board. For the record, this was the same con in which the ever-popular ninja meme "wanna box?" was instantiated. I know now exactly what a middle-aged balding man cowering in fear in an elevator looks like. I also know that there is no point where the Rio will stop serving you alcohol, and I bless them for that.

I swear, when the wait staff starts bringing 8 long islands at a time without even *asking* to your table of six, and they all disappear, you know you're doing something very right or very wrong.

[barkode]

Re: Ninja party is canceled this year

Well said, signine. Well said.

A time when pools were made for playing football with makeshift playing equipment and we heard such phrases as "sorry, she was sitting on my PTT."

Technically I think the wording was "Sorry, the stripper was sitting on my PTT" :)

The last time The Man came to Bring Us Down, I remember hearing a phrase something to the tune of "THIS IS THE RIO EARLY ALERT WARNING SYSTEM. A POTENTIALLY DANGEROUS EVENT HAS BEEN DETECTED ON YOUR FLOOR. PLEASE EVACUATE IN A CALM AND ORDERLY FASHION VIA THE STAIRWELLS. THANK YOU FOR CHOOSING TO STAY AT THE RIO." Considering the severity of that event and the response, I'm rather amazed there were no palms to be greased for our continued patronage of that establishment.

I have _PRICELESS_ video footage of Junk walking down the hallway towards those approaching security guards, waving his arms. They were amazingly cool about it, to their credit.

I think that was at MiniCon 2, wasn't it? Or was that ShadyCon? They all blur together. I think it was MiniCon 2.

It's also worth noting that MiniCon 2 was probably the first event in history to initiate a full-scale Las Vegas Strip hotel evacuation within 10 minutes (literally ten minutes) of entering the premises. Granted, they called it off within about 3 minutes, but it's still notable. Also, it was totally the Rio's fault for putting a smoke detector DIRECTLY ABOVE A PUBLIC ASHTRAY, but I digress.

This was the same con where someone who shall remain unnamed brought a fifth of jack to the breakfast table on Sunday morning, and people were mixing drinks, which made the waitress say something like, "You're the kind of guys that have a bar in your car." and Pesto shot back (without missing a beat), "No, but I do have another waitress in my trunk."

That is in my top ten favorite con moments of all time.

(For the record, MiniCon 2 was all TProphet's fault.)

[Voltage Spike]

Re: Ninja party is canceled this year

You know, I remember once upon a time when parties were ghetto and alcohol was transported via stolen shopping carts.

I think this focus on a few parties is really an artefact of there being limited available space and the atmosphere of the hotel. If the pool had been open, you can be sure there would be a party there. If we had the whole hotel (and I guess we do this year), then I'm sure there would be a few dozen in-room parties that people would wander into.

The planned, mostly-private parties have been around at least as long as I've been going to Defcon, but we paid less attention to them because they weren't as central to the party scene.

It might be interesting to see what would happen if 5000 people just wandered the hallways (at the foot the skybox stairs, entirely in the convention space) and set up extremely mobile party equipment. Someone in the hotel staff may get upset, but at some critical mass it becomes extremely difficult to shut down. This has yet to occur probably due to the existence of extremely large rooms for parties.

[signine]

Re: Ninja party is canceled this year

You know, I remember once upon a time when parties were ghetto and alcohol was transported via stolen shopping carts. In a world when hackers were hackers and the scene was something we all joked about. A time when pools were made for playing football with makeshift playing equipment and we heard such phrases as "sorry, she was sitting on my PTT."

It's truly a shame that as we escalated our awesomeness to such a precipice that The Man came to Bring Us Down. The last time The Man came to Bring Us Down, I remember hearing a phrase something to the tune of "THIS IS THE RIO EARLY ALERT WARNING SYSTEM. A POTENTIALLY DANGEROUS EVENT HAS BEEN DETECTED ON YOUR FLOOR. PLEASE EVACUATE IN A CALM AND ORDERLY FASHION VIA THE STAIRWELLS. THANK YOU FOR CHOOSING TO STAY AT THE RIO." Considering the severity of that event and the response, I'm rather amazed there were no palms to be greased for our continued patronage of that establishment.

Kudos to both barkode and DT for this thread. It has been an enlightening read. I will not be attending Defcon this year due to other financial and time considerations, and the lack of the frosting of the ninja party on the delicious cake that is Defcon.

Perhaps it's time for us to consider the merits of another OOB event of the neither micro nor macro variety at a different time of year?

We can certainly start planning something early and interesting for next year as well.

[Gadsden]

Re: Ninja party is canceled this year

I plan to only use my old worn bladders for non-water drinks.

Truly words to live by!

(Sorry.. I could not resist... )

[theprez98]

Re: Ninja party is canceled this year

It's true that if you put pure booze in a camelbak it will likely have a deleterious (how many points, prez98? ;) effect on the plastic...

12 + 50 point bonus = 62 points ;)