Newbie Track: surviving defcon and other related items

[renderman]

Re: Newbie Track: surviving defcon and other related items

Generally we have possession of the space Thursday for setup, so if minimal A/V is needed, one of the small rooms along the main hallway could be used with minimal disturbance to those setting up

What rings through my mind as a sane order of events is:

1. You wander down on Thursday to register
2. Once registered, wander into the newbie room and hang out for an hour or so to get your orientation
3. Meet others, head off to TBBQ, etc.

I think trying to put too much would ruin Thursday. If we stick to 'Defcon survival basics' we can loop the talks a couple times, then go party. Other 'newbie' talks (technical) might be better suited for a skybox on Friday/Saturday

Basic topics like 'Defcon liver survival', 'Most hostile network on the planet', 'These 6 people will crush you if you screw up' should be on Thursday, Technical stuff, wait for con to officially start.

Just my thoughts

[xor]

Re: Newbie Track: surviving defcon and other related items

Basic topics like 'Defcon liver survival', 'Most hostile network on the planet', 'These 6 people will crush you if you screw up' should be on Thursday, Technical stuff, wait for con to officially start.

You forgot the 1st, 2nd, and 3rd commandments of hacker con's:

1. Thou Shall Not Use The Wireless Network
2. Thou Shall Not Use The Wireless Network
3. Thou Shall Not Use The Wireless Network

Can I get an AMEM brothers & sisters!!!!!



xor

[renderman]

Re: Newbie Track: surviving defcon and other related items

You forgot the 1st, 2nd, and 3rd commandments of hacker con's:

1. Thou Shall Not Use The Wireless Network
2. Thou Shall Not Use The Wireless Network
3. Thou Shall Not Use The Wireless Network

Can I get an AMEM brothers & sisters!!!!!



xor

Reminds me of my latest gig, I walk into the clients offices, everyone reaches for the cat5 for their laptops. It's like I have a reputation or something.

That said, I think that a primer on the network hostility might be useful too, just in case someone*is* stupid enough to do something important and unencrypted

[Wing]

Re: Newbie Track: surviving defcon and other related items

I'd love this. I'll be showing up with a newbie or two and would love for them to be less clueless than I was.

It was hard enough dealing with just the ladyfriend last year (that was a mistake I'm NOT going to repeat, ended up giving up most of my social time and a few billion dollars for her retail therapy because she was disinterested in the con)

[sintax_error]

Re: Newbie Track: surviving defcon and other related items

...

Basic topics like 'Defcon liver survival', 'Most hostile network on the planet', 'These 6 people will crush you if you screw up' should be on Thursday, Technical stuff, wait for con to officially start.

Just my thoughts

Couldn't agree more. This ought to be kind of a "Welcome to your first DEFCON, here are a few tips to keep you alive and with any luck out of jail" gathering rather than a "This will get you started in <insert field here>" presentation. Just my 2¢.

[Xodia]

Re: Newbie Track: surviving defcon and other related items

Excellent thread, I really hope this happens. I would have killed for something like this at my first con.

I have three ideas that come to mind. One would be a simple primer in Google-Fu. So many newcomers have no idea how to use Google, I think a quick intro to using Google effectively would be useful (Words not to use, lesser advertised search strings, search operators, blah blah) .

As far as general Defcon knowledge goes, I think ASTcell was going in the right direction. A discussion of the do's and don'ts of photos/video would be keen. Someone has to let the kiddies know they can't be snapping pictures of people without expecting some consequences occasionally. Equally, they can't get drunk, piss themselves, and be tagged without seeing it on the internet the next day.

For that matter, how to get drunk responsibly in Vegas heat would be a good idea (eating first, hydration, hangover cures, etc)....though I wouldn't have much credibility giving that talk.

[faye]

Re: Newbie Track: surviving defcon

valkyrie- Great idea. I wish there had been a newbie panel last year. I'd even go to one this year even though its not my first time.


And yes. I would love to hear from some girls like you, Dj Jackalope and Mouse. I'd even like to see a "women and hacking" event in the future. Im sure a lot of people, male and female alike would be interested in a talk from females who have earned respect throughout the hacking community, how they did it, and the struggles they faced. More to come on that idea later, but too tired at the moment to go into it further.

In particular, I would suggest that photo's of key people (DT, Priest, Russ, Roamer, etc) be shown along with the human equivalent of Material Safety Data Sheets of not pissing them off, or what is worth bugging them about (i.e. this is the Goon shirt, they are here for fun enforcement, if someone preventing you from having fun by being a dick, bring this to their attention)

That would have been good to know last year. This should definitely be included in the newbie guide since newbies are most likely to be the ones to accidentally piss someone off then get stalked and harassed the entire rest of the con all for having done something stupid. Everyone makes mistakes, but no one should take it upon themselves to punish someone else. Noobs should know where to turn if they do get harassed for whatever reason..... ejecting someone from the con should be reserved for serious offenses that actually injure someone, (assault, theft, rape) and should be left up to those in charge. as the powers at be say "Hey Douchebags...we Don't Need Your Help"

apologies to those I offended last year, and I hope I get to make up for my mistakes this year. (See suggestion 5 below)

Couldn't agree more. This ought to be kind of a "Welcome to your first DEFCON, here are a few tips to keep you alive and with any luck out of jail" gathering rather than a "This will get you started in <insert field here>" presentation. Just my 2¢.

Agreed. I would avoid making it your responsibility to inform newbies of all the events at defcon, as they can read about it for themselves in the program guide/description of events in the defcon booklet you get. Though one or two sentences on new events might not be a bad idea for those that are regulars but attend your newbie panel anyway.


Some suggested topics might be:
1. watch how much you drink... and what you say, and especially what you say while drinking. : )

2. never give out your real phone number- you never know when your clone is going to attend a party in your absence and make an ass out of you.- Even if you dont happen to have a clone, its always a possibility that you might make an ass out of yourself all on your own, and if you do, your # will most likely end up on the forums somewhere... lol


3. Google can be your best friend, and your worst enemy. If theres something you dont want others knowing, make sure its not google-able.

(and yes Valkyrie you have my express permission to use me as an example while explaining 1, 2, and 3 lol)


4. how you can tell if someone is a Fed? Cause Federal Agents dont go around wearing shirts saying "I'm a Fed" like newbies might think they will.

5. If you piss someone off, buy them a six pack.... chances are they'll forgive whatever it was you did to annoy them, and if not, they'll at least forget about it after they've downed the alcohol you bought them. (wish I had thought of that last year)


(please ignore if any are already listed-too damn tired to read the entire thread but want to post my ideas before I forget)

[valkyrie]

Re: Newbie Track: surviving defcon

valkyrie- Great idea. I wish there had been a newbie panel last year. I'd even go to one this year even though its not my first time.

It wasn't my idea. I just decided to precipitously act on it.

And yes. I would love to hear from some girls like you, Dj Jackalope and Mouse. I'd even like to see a "women and hacking" event in the future. Im sure a lot of people, male and female alike would be interested in a talk from females who have earned respect throughout the hacking community, how they did it, and the struggles they faced. More to come on that idea later, but too tired at the moment to go into it further.

Lopey, Mouse, Raven, Mfreeck, OP: tons of wonderful feminine geekiness and I apologize if I didn't shout out all the grrrrls who have enhanced my life by their personal demonstation. They are all so incredibly awesome. A women and hacking event? I think not. It doesn't have to be an "event." I don't think I am necessarily respected because I am a female who just happens to hack. I just hack. If I get respect for that, well, ok. How we did it? I suppose we just did it. Struggles we faced? I have to laugh at this one Faye. We all face struggles. Men and women. There is no gender bias there.

That would have been good to know last year. This should definitely be included in the newbie guide since newbies are most likely to be the ones to accidentally piss someone off

Actually, several people attempted to unofficially school you last year about what was appropriate and what wasn't appropriate and it didn't seem to stick.

then get stalked and harassed the entire rest of the con all for having done something stupid. Everyone makes mistakes, but no one should take it upon themselves to punish someone else.

You seem to still be making excuses for yourself. Please quit bringing it up. Let it go. Start again.

Noobs should know where to turn if they do get harassed for whatever reason..... ejecting someone from the con should be reserved for serious offenses that actually injure someone, (assault, theft, rape) and should be left up to those in charge. as the powers at be say "Hey Douchebags...we Don't Need Your Help"

Faye, we self police at con. The forums have some really wicked smart admins who police the forums, but we self-police at con unless things look like they are getting out of control. If things look like they are getting out of control, find a redshirt. They are always
around and they really are there to make the DefCon experience one that is pleasurable. If you can't find a redshirt, go to the DefCon Information booth and they will find one for you.

apologies to those I offended last year, and I hope I get to make up for my mistakes this year. (See suggestion 5 below)

Your apologies have been accepted by everyone on the forum (at least from what I have read). Come back next year, be yourself and don't get all trifling and petty. As a matter of fact, bring something fun to share with others. Your ideas.

Regards,

valkyrie
__________________________________________________ __________
sapere aude

[Dallas]

Re: Newbie Track: surviving defcon

Yep. Good suggestions all around. I think everyone feels there is a need for a newbie meeting prior to the con, or at the start. It will help them get into the con and avoid the most common mistakes.

It wasn't my idea. I just decided to precipitously act on it.




Lopey, Mouse, Raven, Mfreeck, OP: tons of wonderful feminine geekiness and I apologize if I didn't shout out all the grrrrls who have enhanced my life by their personal demonstation. They are all so incredibly awesome. A women and hacking event? I think not. It doesn't have to be an "event." I don't think I am necessarily respected because I am a female who just happens to hack. I just hack. If I get respect for that, well, ok. How we did it? I suppose we just did it. Struggles we faced? I have to laugh at this one Faye. We all face struggles. Men and women. There is no gender bias there.



Actually, several people attempted to unofficially school you last year about what was appropriate and what wasn't appropriate and it didn't seem to stick.



You seem to still be making excuses for yourself. Please quit bringing it up. Let it go. Start again.



Faye, we self police at con. The forums have some really wicked smart admins who police the forums, but we self-police at con unless things look like they are getting out of control. If things look like they are getting out of control, find a redshirt. They are always
around and they really are there to make the DefCon experience one that is pleasurable. If you can't find a redshirt, go to the DefCon Information booth and they will find one for you.




Your apologies have been accepted by everyone on the forum (at least from what I have read). Come back next year, be yourself and don't get all trifling and petty. As a matter of fact, bring something fun to share with others. Your ideas.

Regards,

valkyrie
__________________________________________________ __________
sapere aude

[astcell]

Re: Newbie Track: surviving defcon and other related items

We cut slack at Defcon but there are those who are simply asking for trouble (or cruisin' for a bruisin' for those of us who remember the 70s).

YES you may wake up naked in a strange hotel, in a strange town not in Las Vegas.
YES you may end with Sharpie writing all over you, some of it only visible by your proctologist.
YES you may find your credit cards missing and maxxed out at the strip club down the road.
YES you may get offered a drink that is (gasp!) not what they told you it was.
YES you may be lied to, cheated on, stolen from, and mentally or physically abused.
YES your laptop, passwords, Ebay account, or all of the above may be stolen.
YES you may flash your breasts for 1/1000th of a second and there will be 200 pictures of it on the Internet within the hour.
YES. YES. YES.

Welcome to 8,000 people with too much time, technology, alcohol and brain cell firings on their hands.

[Dallas]

Re: Newbie Track: surviving defcon and other related items

I can attest to have experienced and caused..umm 6 out of 7. Don't really like to steal stuff however. Snow and her magic marker was not cool...

We cut slack at Defcon but there are those who are simply asking for trouble (or cruisin' for a bruisin' for those of us who remember the 70s).

YES you may wake up naked in a strange hotel, in a strange town not in Las Vegas.
YES you may end with Sharpie writing all over you, some of it only visible by your proctologist.
YES you may find your credit cards missing and maxxed out at the strip club down the road.
YES you may get offered a drink that is (gasp!) not what they told you it was.
YES you may be lied to, cheated on, stolen from, and mentally or physically abused.
YES your laptop, passwords, Ebay account, or all of the above may be stolen.
YES you may flash your breasts for 1/1000th of a second and there will be 200 pictures of it on the Internet within the hour.
YES. YES. YES.

Welcome to 8,000 people with too much time, technology, alcohol and brain cell firings on their hands.

[faye]

Re: Newbie Track: surviving defcon and other related items

YES you may wake up naked in a strange hotel, in a strange town not in Las Vegas.
YES you may end with Sharpie writing all over you, some of it only visible by your proctologist.
YES you may find your credit cards missing and maxxed out at the strip club down the road.
YES you may get offered a drink that is (gasp!) not what they told you it was.
YES you may be lied to, cheated on, stolen from, and mentally or physically abused.
YES your laptop, passwords, Ebay account, or all of the above may be stolen.
YES you may flash your breasts for 1/1000th of a second and there will be 200 pictures of it on the Internet within the hour.

Wow. Sounds like I need to come back next year for the real defcon experience. Maybe I wasnt drinking enough?

[astcell]

Re: Newbie Track: surviving defcon and other related items

Wow. Sounds like I need to come back next year for the real defcon experience. Maybe I wasnt drinking enough?

No. You ran away from a dinner conversation because of a camera, you were un-nice to some very very sweet people, you made yourself look like the female version of Jon Arbuckle, and you deny what everyone knows.

But we always let folks start over -- once. So chill and just be you.

[SecurityBarbie]

Re: Newbie Track: surviving defcon

Some suggested topics might be:
1. watch how much you drink... and what you say, and especially what you say while drinking. : )

2. never give out your real phone number- you never know when your clone is going to attend a party in your absence and make an ass out of you.- Even if you dont happen to have a clone, its always a possibility that you might make an ass out of yourself all on your own, and if you do, your # will most likely end up on the forums somewhere... lol

3. Google can be your best friend, and your worst enemy. If theres something you dont want others knowing, make sure its not google-able.

(and yes Valkyrie you have my express permission to use me as an example while explaining 1, 2, and 3 lol)

4. how you can tell if someone is a Fed? Cause Federal Agents dont go around wearing shirts saying "I'm a Fed" like newbies might think they will.

5. If you piss someone off, buy them a six pack.... chances are they'll forgive whatever it was you did to annoy them, and if not, they'll at least forget about it after they've downed the alcohol you bought them. (wish I had thought of that last year)

(please ignore if any are already listed-too damn tired to read the entire thread but want to post my ideas before I forget)

BTW... your #1 should be something we all learned a LONG time ago, common sense... those who haven't learned this will not be changed by just telling them..... perhaps the best idea for them is to not drink if they can't be responsible for what they say or do......

[astcell]

Re: Newbie Track: surviving defcon and other related items

Once again Faye you want this to be all about you. It is not. The sooner you accept that fact the sooner you can see what Defcon really is all about.

At Defcon I have never met more caring, intelligent, and selfless people anywhere else. It is an honor and a privilege to walk amongst them. Don't muddy the waters.