Recent Events - Airplane Bathroom Cameras

[AgentDarkApple]

Re: Recent Events - Airplane Bathroom Cameras

5. Behavioral Profiling

I thought your idea was a good one, but I had no idea this was already being implemented. I found this article today http://www.nationalterroralert.com/u...e-on-airports/

[streaker69]

Re: Recent Events - Airplane Bathroom Cameras

I thought your idea was a good one, but I had no idea this was already being implemented. I found this article today http://www.nationalterroralert.com/u...e-on-airports/

I'm glad to see articles like this coming out. I think the regular populace and sees 'profiling' and immediately assumes it's entirely about race or religion. The general populace needs to be more educated that profiling looks at a wide variety of factors.

[theprez98]

Re: Recent Events - Airplane Bathroom Cameras

I'm glad to see that the TSA is so vigilant that they couldn't even stop a man from walking through an exit on the public side to the secure side.

You know that one TSA person sitting at the exit, probably reading a book or newspaper; what is it that they do other than ensure that the exit is a one way valve for passengers?!

And of course, they never found the guy; but not for taking passengers off of flights that had already been boarded and forced them to go through screening again.

AQ must be laughing at the perception/reality of our incompetence.

[theprez98]

Re: Recent Events - Airplane Bathroom Cameras

I think that lost in all the discussion over these new TSA rules (special screenings for people from certain countries, etc.) is that we're asking other people in these countries to carry them out for us. Sure, we have some supposed leverage over them ("Follow our rules or you won't be able to fly into our country!"), but this isn't even the TSA doing the pat-downs, the supplementary screenings, the millimeter wave radar scans, etc., it's the security staffs of these foreign airlines and airports. What sort of training do they have? What do we know about their backgrounds and such? Do they even have a millimeter wave radar scanner (some do, courtesy of the U.S. State Department) and even more importantly, do they know how do use it? For example, Nigeria has four such scanners given by the U.S. State Department, but apparently either doesn't use them or doesn't have the expertise to use them.

The latest news is that some foreign airports are simply ignoring the TSA rules.

[Chris]

Re: Recent Events - Airplane Bathroom Cameras

I think that lost in all the discussion over these new TSA rules (special screenings for people from certain countries, etc.) is that we're asking other people in these countries to carry them out for us. Sure, we have some supposed leverage over them ("Follow our rules or you won't be able to fly into our country!"), but this isn't even the TSA doing the pat-downs, the supplementary screenings, the millimeter wave radar scans, etc., it's the security staffs of these foreign airlines and airports. What sort of training do they have? What do we know about their backgrounds and such? Do they even have a millimeter wave radar scanner (some do, courtesy of the U.S. State Department) and even more importantly, do they know how do use it? For example, Nigeria has four such scanners given by the U.S. State Department, but apparently either doesn't use them or doesn't have the expertise to use them.

The latest news is that some foreign airports are simply ignoring the TSA rules.

Agreed. I made this point in post 18 of this thread as well.

https://forum.defcon.org/showpost.ph...3&postcount=18

[theprez98]

Re: Recent Events - Airplane Bathroom Cameras

Agreed. I made this point in post 18 of this thread as well.

https://forum.defcon.org/showpost.ph...3&postcount=18

Ah yes, I missed that one! But yeah, the point remains. They don't give a shit about our rules.

[Lowie]

Re: Recent Events - Airplane Bathroom Cameras

Ah yes, I missed that one! But yeah, the point remains. They don't give a shit about our rules.

This is true.

But is that not inevitable when, as pointed out many times in this thread and others, those rules that these countries don't give a shit about have become incredibly convoluted and mostly pointless?

[streaker69]

Re: Recent Events - Airplane Bathroom Cameras

This is most curious:

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/01...n_electrician/

The unnamed sparks was returning to Ireland, where's he's lived for four years, unaware that his baggage contained enough RDX "to blow up the plane mid-air". The plastic was one of "eight pieces of contraband... planted by the authorities in the baggage of innocent passengers to test the airport’s security procedures".

So authorities basically framed an innocent man in an attempt to test security. WTF!?!

[beakmyn]

Re: Recent Events - Airplane Bathroom Cameras

This is most curious:

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/01...n_electrician/



So authorities basically framed an innocent man in an attempt to test security. WTF!?!

Common practice actually. A random bag is picked and contraband is inserted to test the system. Unfortunately, when the system fails, as it has many times in the past, the innocent victim is in for a big surprise. But in this case that's f*cked up!

[streaker69]

Re: Recent Events - Airplane Bathroom Cameras

Common practice actually. A random bag is picked and contraband is inserted to test the system. Unfortunately, when the system fails, as it has many times in the past, the innocent victim is in for a big surprise. But in this case that's f*cked up!

I think it's fucked up to begin with of picking innocent citizens to do that, especially since they were using a real explosive. What if the guy got it home and it somehow detonated?

It's total bullshit to be subjecting innocent people to that kind of thing.

[TheCotMan]

Re: Recent Events - Airplane Bathroom Cameras

The testing for *carry-on* luggage I've seen includes an employee bringing up a bag with known "bad items" for scanning. They act like a traveler, and wait for security to be called. This contains the test to the location being tested, and only involves people that are part of test test, no civilians. Why can't this be applied to internal testing of checked luggage? The luggage could be luggage not associated with any real passenger, only luggage owned by the people testing the system at the site. (The test I observed for carry-on luggage was at a New York or New Jersey airport.)

[streaker69]

Re: Recent Events - Airplane Bathroom Cameras

The testing for *carry-on* luggage I've seen includes an employee bringing up a bag with known "bad items" for scanning. They act like a traveler, and wait for security to be called. This contains the test to the location being tested, and only involves people that are part of test test, no civilians. Why can't this be applied to internal testing of checked luggage? The luggage could be luggage not associated with any real passenger, only luggage owned by the people testing the system at the site. (The test I observed for carry-on luggage was at a New York or New Jersey airport.)

Plus, why did they need to use 90Grams of RDX in the test they did with this guy? Couldn't they have used something with the same consistency and density as RDX with a little bit of the real stuff sprinkled over it for the smell? To plant 90grams on someone and then lose track of it is insane. What if they had planted in a child's bag that was traveling with their parents, or even a lone for that matter?

What if they planted it in a soldier's bag that happened to set off the detectors at the main gate because of explosive residue on his clothes from being in an active war zone and then they find RDX in his checked luggage? You'd hope they'd have it sorted out, but what if it wasn't found until he had already left the airport where it was planted.

This method of testing seems to be terribly flawed.

[charliex]

Re: Recent Events - Airplane Bathroom Cameras

Amsterdam airport had the full body scanners in test /secondary screen before the USA did, and that the USA house voted against their usage as primary scanners. Amsterdam has something like 15 machines, and they've supposedly ordered another 60 more.

Granted some people say these machines aren't effective, but now they are being deployed in the USA too.

You're fooling yourself if you don't think the USA has some very serious political whack with other countries, they've interferred with other countries on a lot less than this.

[DaKahuna]

Re: Recent Events - Airplane Bathroom Cameras

Amsterdam airport had the full body scanners in test /secondary screen before the USA did, and that the USA house voted against their usage as primary scanners.

Not so fast -- read today where there is now an issue with the use of the full body scanners on minors is being seen as child pornography!

[charliex]

Re: Recent Events - Airplane Bathroom Cameras

I've heard that one for a while, if you make a law wide enough, it's likely to overlap something. Though I don't think that is distinctive beween Europe/ROW and the USA. It may even be a bigger issue in the USA than elsewhere.