Organization

[klepto]

That's exactly what I plan to do.

Thank you for being the bigger person.

[Grond]

Defcon doesn't just cost 80 bucks. Plane fair, time off from work, hotel fees etc need to be considered. And no, The ATM presentation wasn't good. The old man that was up there starting talking about fire axes and fork lifts as a way to exploit ATMs. And hey, he told us not to use ATMs in wierd spaces. This was a good one, buy one on ebay and put it somewhere.

The "Old Man" you refer to is one of the greatest minds of our time, and the fact that you don't know that says a lot. He's been places and done things you can't even dream of. He is by all accounts an American hero. His son is pretty damn smart too...look them up sometime and weep in your own ignorance.

He may have a little trouble speaking these days, and his talks at BlackHat and Defcon might have been a little slow, but he his as old school hardcore as they come, and you should consider yourself lucky to have seen Dr. Morris while he's still with us. I can only hope that if I ever reach his age I might garnish a little more respect from puny minds such as yourself.

I'm glad you won't be there next year. More free beer for me and the good Doctor.

-g

[Falln]

I don't doubt his genius. I'm sure he is a smarter person than I could fathom. This holds no bearing, however, on his speaking abilities, which were sub-par, and the content presented, which was trivial.

[TheCotMan]

And no, The ATM presentation wasn't good.

Opinions are like assholes, and you've got too many. Time to plug some of those hole up, because you are getting crap everywhere.

The old man that was up there starting talking about

You do not know who he is, do you?

fire axes and fork lifts as a way to exploit ATMs. And hey, he told us not to use ATMs in wierd spaces. This was a good one, buy one on ebay and put it somewhere.

These are issues that exist today. There have been successful runs where people have done just that. Drop an ATM at a busy location to copy mag-strip data from inserted cards, & PINs and then tell the user that there was a problem. After a few days at a busy location, think of the numbers of card/pin combinations that could be "gathered."

About 2 years ago, we had a presentation (perhaps by him or an associate of his) where there was discussion of pseudo card readers placed onto existing machines, made to look like they were part of the existing ATM. People would insert their card into what they though was the ATM but in reality, the fake device was actually stealing their MagStip data and a camera was recording the PIN keys.

Issues where slots on valid ATM were stuck with debris with a lookout person set to watch the PIN from a distance. The Debris caused the card to get stuck, and when the person left, the abuser would come back with a long strip of metal to yank the card, clear the debris, use the card and steal money.

As for "strange places" that is a serious one too. You would be surprised at how many ATM have a mirror, or glossy surface in front of them to allow people to look into reflections to see your PIN, or transparrent surfaces that create an illusion of privacy.

Last year he spoke about risks to leaving your receipts from ATM transactions laying about, and information leakage with the information that is printed. He hinted that he was going to speak about this as a risk this year, but I missed DC this year.

Glad to read you won't be there again.

[skroo]

I don't doubt his genius. I'm sure he is a smarter person than I could fathom. This holds no bearing, however, on his speaking abilities, which were sub-par, and the content presented, which was trivial.

Jumping Jesus on a pogo stick, Stuart. Are you the kind of person who just pisses and moans about everything because they can?

You want to know what sucks at Defcon? Driving across the desert to hang out with your friends, then getting dragged to hospital on Thursday night with an intestinal infection that keeps you 90% out of action for the rest of the weekend. Missing all the talks you wanted to see and parties you wanted to go to. Not being able to adequately carry your share of the responsibilities within the networking goons because of the same. Driving back home across the same desert and nearly killing yourself en route because the medication you've been given is beating the living hell out of your metabolism. And finally, the cherry on top: getting to listen to someone piss and moan after the fact because the schedule changed and he couldn't figure out how to keep up with it despite being surrounded by six thousand other people who seemed to have their shit together enough that, despite the inconveniences, they (and I) still managed to have an enjoyable weekend.

Oh, and while we're at it: the 'old man's' proper name is Robert Tappan Morris, Sr., who has done a damn sight more for you that you obviously realise. At least have the decency to show respect for someone who has made it entirely possible for you to step up on the public soapbox and make a total ass of yourself.

Fucking retard. Seriously, stay home next year and invest the $80 you just saved on a 55-gallon drum of Massengill sand-removal formula.